------------------------------
The Old-Time Radio Digest!
Volume 2003 : Issue 143
A Part of the [removed]!
ISSN: 1533-9289
Today's Topics:
Struts & Frets and the "Great Find" [ badaxley@[removed] ]
Obit - Peggy Conklin [ Alan Chapman <[removed]@verizon. ]
April 5th Birth Dates [ Ron Sayles <bogusotr@[removed]; ]
Elizabeth's gag [ Al Girard <24agirard24@[removed] ]
In defense of Elizabeth; MASH [ Rick Keating <pkeating89@[removed]; ]
OTR personalities in lawsuits [ otrdigest@[removed] ]
Re: April fools [ Ga6string@[removed] ]
April Fool [ "Mark Kinsler" <kinsler33@[removed] ]
Elizabeth and April fools [ "Cancilla Dominick" <[removed]@buc ]
James Stewart Papers [ "George Tirebiter" <tirebiter2@hotm ]
Elizabeth's New "Find" [ "John Eccles, Jr." <jeccles@earthli ]
Re: Ken Niles/Ken Carpenter [ Elizabeth McLeod <lizmcl@[removed] ]
Cincinnati guest [ "Bob Burchett" <haradio@[removed] ]
For those who couldn't or wouldn't g [ operator99@[removed] ]
Somebody Knows [ Harry Bartell <bartell@[removed] ]
Elizabeth's Joke [ Bryan Wright <bswrig@[removed]; ]
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 15:19:35 -0500
From: badaxley@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: Struts & Frets and the "Great Find"
Many, many thanks to you Harry for your great series on radio, presented in
Struts and Frets. It provided an insight that is not available when authors,
not actually associated with medium, write a book. I am only sorry that you
have concluded with the writing. However, I can understand. Again, thanks
for
a great series.
Elizabeth's "great find" will teach all of us, I guess, to just discard the
April 1 digest, if we don't want to be "fooled". However, that is part of the
day, so nobody should be too upset. I personally was prepared to forget the
whole digest last year after trying to "decode" that one. Happy April Fool's
day!
Bob Axley
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 15:48:52 -0500
From: Alan Chapman <[removed]@[removed];
To: Old-Time Radio Digest <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Obit - Peggy Conklin
Spotted this obit the other day:
[LA TIMES - March 27] - Peggy Conklin, the pert "girl next door" actress
from the 1930s through the 1950s who was a star on Broadway ... has died
at the agoe of 96 on March 18 at her home in Naples, Fla., of natural
causes.
On Broadway, she appeared in more than two dozen major plays, including
the female lead in "Petrified Forest" (opposite Leslie Howard and
Humphrey Bogart), "The Pursuit of Happiness," "Yes, My Darling
Daughter," "Mr. & Mrs. North," and "Picnic."
On radio, Dunning shows her as a regular in "Big Sister" in the early
40s, "The Stu Erwin Show" ('45), "That's My Pop" ('45), and "McGarry and
His Mouse" ('46). She also played Peg Riley in "The Life of Riley"
briefly in 1941, and she was Pam North (a role she starred in on
Broadway) in the audition show of "Mr. & Mrs. North" (opposite Carl
Eastman). She also was heard in several radio plays.
-- Alan
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 16:16:46 -0500
From: Ron Sayles <bogusotr@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: April 5th Birth Dates
If you were born on the 5th of April, you share your birthday with:
04-05-1900 - Spencer Tracy - Milwaukee, WI
04-05-1901 - Melvyn Douglas - Macon, GA - d. 8-4-1981
04-05-1908 - Bette Davis - Lowell, MA - d. 10-6-1989
04-05-1916 - Gregory Peck - Lo Jolla, CA
04-05-1922 - Gale Storm - Bloomington, TX
04-05-1934 - Frank Gorshin - Pittsburgh, PA
Ron Sayles
Milwaukee, Wisconsin
Make your day, listen to an Olde Tyme Radio Program
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 16:17:19 -0500
From: Al Girard <24agirard24@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: Elizabeth's gag
SOUND: Footsteps on wooden sidewalk. Dog barks in the distance
CHESTER: Mr. Dillon, did you read the mail? It's on your desk.
MATT: Yes, Chester . . . I read it.
CHESTER: Did you see the message about a new find?
MATT: Yes. You read it too, did you?
CHESTER: I sure did, Mr. Dillon. Ain't there something
that you can do about it?
MATT: Afraid not, Chester. I know that a lot of good folks
will be disappointed, but what she did wasn't against
the
law.
CHESTER: Guess not, Mr. Dillon. But a lot of folks were caught anawares,
weren't
they?
MATT: They sure were!
SOUND: A dog barks in the distance.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 18:48:55 -0500
From: Rick Keating <pkeating89@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: In defense of Elizabeth; MASH
A lot of people are angry (or just annoyed) at
Elizabeth's little joke. While the revelation that
this cache of OTR material doesn't exist no doubt came
as a disappointment to many, let's keep things in
perspective.
A few years ago on a message board I sometimes visited
(which had no connection with OTR) one of the regulars
posted the news that a popular contributor-- a school
teacher in Florida-- had been killed by a drunk
driver, leaving behind a husband and children. Several
people offered messages of condolences and support for
her family, [removed]
A few weeks later, after some people had tried to find
more information about their late friend, troubling
questions arose, such as why no one could find any
mention of the woman's death in any newspaper in her
area. Soon the truth emerged. The woman (more
accurately a girl) was still very much alive and was
neither a school teacher, nor a wife and mother. When
she finally came forward, she claimed someone else had
posted the message about her "death" and that she
regretted not coming forward immediately to dispel
that rumor. Some people believed her and forgave her;
others didn't and broke away to form a separate
message board. Today, neither board is operating.
There are a lot more serious and damaging "jokes" than
Elizabeth's-- and this other one didn't occur on April
Fool's day. Though it still would've been tasteless if
it had. So, let's all keep that in mind.
I also have to agree that the size of the find
should've been a tip off to it being bogus.
Secondly, in response to Ryan Osentowski, my comment
wasn't that M*A*S*H couldn't work in an audio only
format (I listed some specific episodes that work just
fine that way), but that some of the humor would be
lost in a direct translation from a visual to an audio
medium since some of the jokes were clearly meant to
be seen. The example I cited with Klinger and Gen.
Steele would either need a bit of dialogue to set up
the payoff, or a narrator describing Klinger's
approach.
Rick
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 18:50:24 -0500
From: otrdigest@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: OTR personalities in lawsuits
I thought it would be interesting to list a few
lawsuits involving OTR personalities.
Lauck v. E. C. K. Chivers & Associates, 320 F. Supp.
463
Florida cityslickers set up a subsidary to sell
Lumburgers in Arkansas. Lum and Abner sue the
varmints. The court holds that there was personal
jurisdiction in Arkansas, and the suit could go
furward.
---
Benny v. Commissioner, 25 [removed] 197 (1955)
The court sides with Jack in his fight with the
Commissioner of the [removed] His vault is safe again.
---
Benny v. Loew's, Inc., 239 [removed] 532 (1956)
Jack presents a parody of the movie "Gas Light" on his
television show in a sketch called "Autolight". The
owner of the copyright sues for copyright
infringement. Jack loses. The decision was criticized
at the time by copyright commentators, and Congress
later repudiated the decision by recognizing parody
in the Copyright Act of 1976.
---
Cohen v. Marx, 94 Cal. App. 2d 704 (1949)
On January 12, 1949, Groucho Marx said on the program
"You Bet Your Life," "I once managed a prize-fighter,
Canvasback Cohen. I brought him out here, he got
knocked out, and I made him walk back to Cleveland"
Canvasback Cohen sues but is knocked out by Groucho,
because Cohen was a public figure.
---
Feldman v. Amos & Andy, 21 [removed] 823 (1934)
Feldman tried to register a trademark of Amos & Andy
for workshirts. A regusted Correll & Godsden sue and
win.
---
Welles v. CBS, 308 [removed] 810 (1962)
Orson Welles sues CBS for using portions of "War of
the Worlds" radio broadcast in a 1957 television play
called "The Night America Trembled". Welles lost the
war when the court ruled that he was not the copyright
owner of the script.
---
Not breaching his [removed]
Andrew Steinberg
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 18:50:50 -0500
From: Ga6string@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: Re: April fools
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At a time when Americans and British troops and Iraqi soldiers and civilians
are dying in Iraq, and at a time when yet another mysterious virus is causing
concern and loss of life around the globe, at a time when lots of folks are
being laid off from their jobs and wondering how they're going to pay their
bills, I am truly bewildered that anyone would get their feelings hurt by an
April Fool's joke about old radio programs. C'mon, life's way too short,
y'all!
Sincerely,
Bryan Powell
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------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 18:51:25 -0500
From: "Mark Kinsler" <kinsler33@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: April Fool
I fell for two related April Fool's schemes. One was Ms McLeod's.
The other was featured on National Public Radio's 'All Things Considered.'
It described a massive archiving project by the Library of Congress to
transcribe all LC audio material to a proven archival medium, to wit,
mechanically-recorded shellac disks. Several examples were played, and a
fairly good argument was presented for the use of the shellac disks. I
suppose that they _are_ archival--some have lasted for a hundred years.
The ATC 'letters' feature on the April 2 program revealed that it was an
April Fool's hoax.
I must say that Recent Events have seriously blunted my sense of humor. But
I'm rather glad I heard the next day's disclaimer before I wrote about this
story to Prof Biel or this list.
Mark Kinsler
512 E Mulberry St. Lancaster, Ohio USA 43130 740-687-6368
[removed]~mkinsler1
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 18:52:24 -0500
From: "Cancilla Dominick" <[removed]@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Elizabeth and April fools
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I, for one, was completely taken in by Elizabeth's posting. I did notice the
April 1 mentions, and paused in my reading for a second, but my implicit trust
of everything Elizabeth said overran my skepticism. Oh what a fool I was!
I can't complain too much about April Fools jokes, since I tend to do them
myself. As I mentioned in a post a few days ago, I write for [removed],
and wrote an article about 99 Cents Only stores opening 99 Cents Only gas
stations.
Anyway, to get back on topic, I'd like to imagine for a moment that
Elizabeth's find was real. What would you hope she would have discovered? What
is your "holy grail" of OTR?
Personally, I'd love to hear the original I Love a Mystery series, and I'm
sure many of you would agree.
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------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 18:52:42 -0500
From: "George Tirebiter" <tirebiter2@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: James Stewart Papers
Jimmy Stewart's papers are at Brigham Young University. Go to:
[removed]
I remember late in his life it was announced that he had donated his papers
to that institution. Reporters asked if that meant he was converting to
Mormonism and he replied that he hadn't and they were simply the only ones
to ask for them. (I wonder what whoever was responsible for acquiring such
things at Princeton, his alma mater, thought when he/she saw that comment!)
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 18:52:52 -0500
From: "John Eccles, Jr." <jeccles@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Elizabeth's New "Find"
As far as Elizabeth's announcement of her new "find", Marian Jordan said it
best. "Tain't Funny, McGee."
John Eccles, Jr.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 19:12:59 -0500
From: Elizabeth McLeod <lizmcl@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Re: Ken Niles/Ken Carpenter
On 4/4/03 6:14 PM OldRadio Mailing Lists wrote:
In the September 18, 1934 Woodbury Program starring Bing Crosby, Bing
refers to his announcer as "Kenneth Niles." I was wondering if Kenneth
Niles changed his name to Ken Carpenter later on, and if he is related to
announcer Wendell Niles. If so, how are they are related and which man
started in radio first? I've thought before that they sounded very similar
in their delivery and perhaps might be brothers.
Kenneth Niles and Ken Carpenter were two separate people, but they *were*
both announcers on the West Coast during the OTR era, and did have rather
similar voices.
Ken Niles was Wendell Niles' older brother, and had his earliest major
success in radio on the staff of KHJ beginning around 1929-30. He was a
regular member of that station's dramatic stock company thru the
Depression era, and when KHJ dramatic director Lindsay MacHarrie moved on
to the Radio Transcription Company of America around 1933, Niles was one
of several KHJ staffers to begin moonlighting in Transco syndicated
programs.
His longest-term identification was with the Campbell Soup Company, as
regular announcer for "Hollywood Hotel" and most other programs sponsored
by Campbells from the mid-1930s to the early 1940s. He worked with Burns
and Allen during their Campbell's period, and did occasionall hitch-hike
commercials on "Amos 'n' Andy" from 1938 to 1940.
Ken and Wendell Niles weren't the only brother act to work as network
radio announcers, nor were they even the first. That honor goes to Herluf
and Marthin Provensen, who were both on the staff of NBC during the late
twenties. (And despite their names, they aren't an April Fool Joke.)
Elizabeth
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 19:13:21 -0500
From: "Bob Burchett" <haradio@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Cincinnati guest
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Bob Hastings, Hal Stone, John Rayburn, and a good maybe, Herb Ellis.
Just talked to him tonight. Will let me know next week.
He may not be able to leave his wife who has health
problems. She may be well enough next week so he can come.
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------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 19:28:15 -0500
From: operator99@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: For those who couldn't or wouldn't get the
joke
sigh.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 19:29:25 -0500
From: Harry Bartell <bartell@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Somebody Knows
Don Frey has written, in part
The opening had/has a voice in
an echo chamber proclaiming "Somebody Knows!" That voice, at least on the
one program I have, is Harry Bartell.
Correct except for a small point. There may have been an echo chamber added
but the weird sound came from the line being read between the strings and
top of a grand piano. It also provided an interesting buzz in the reader's
teeth
Harry Bartell
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 19:31:15 -0500
From: Bryan Wright <bswrig@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Elizabeth's Joke
Having read the thoughts of other Digest members, I just had to offer my
response to Elizabeth's April Fool's Day joke. So, permit me to slip into my
best Throckmorton P. Gildersleeve voice to say:
"You're a hard woman, McLeod!"
And now, to say "Bravo!" for the best April Fool's Day joke I've ever fallen
for.
At 9:30 PM on April 1, I was just beginning to get sorry that the entire day
had passed by without a single April Fool's Day gag. Before heading to bed,
I checked my e-mail and saw Elizabeth's posting on 78-L (where it did make
the rounds on April 1st). Upon reading of her discovery, I soon found myself
dancing circles in the middle of the room celebrating such an amazing find.
Returning to my chair, I was just about to forward the message to some of my
other OTR friends, when I paused with the realization that it *was* April
Fool's Day. The release projected release date of April 1, 2004 was a bit
upsetting, and as the saying goes, if something sounds too good to be true,
it probably is. "No," I thought, "Elizabeth McLeod wouldn't joke about a
find like that, and besides, with all the details and third parties like the
First Generation Radio Archives she provided, it has to be true." Still, I
had a few doubts in my mind, but found it very difficult to go to sleep that
night. I was too excited! I wanted so much to believe Elizabeth's note, that
I suppose for the most part, I did!
It wasn't until the next evening, after a whole day of chuckling to myself
that "the find of the century" had finally been made, that I found out it
was just a joke. Initially, I was *so* very disappointed. I didn't think it
was funny at all. It was as if the discs really HAD been uncovered and then
intentionally destroyed (like the famous story of the "Vic and Sade" shows).
Over the past couple days, I've fully recovered from my initial
disappointment, and now realize this is one of the best April Fool's Day
pranks I've ever come across.
I think the biggest key to Elizabeth's joke was that she knew her audience
so well: we all really wanted the discovery to be real. Elizabeth was able
to provide so many details that it was entirely convincing--to me at least
(I particularly liked the description of the corroded condition of that
first Sherlock Holmes broadcast to bring things a little more down to
Earth). The names and dates made it even more realistic. It proves there's a
real art to crafting the perfect April Fool's Day joke--and Elizabeth's got
it! Even after a full day of being on my top guard against April Fool's
pranks, this one got the better of me.
As for being [removed] well, one of my favorite responses to the joke came
from Dave Lennick on 78-L who said something to the effect that he had dibs
on all record collections within a thousand mile radius from people who had
a heart attack while reading Elizabeth's announcement.
Still, thanks, Elizabeth, for an April Fool's Day joke I will remember for
quite a while. For a whole day I was up in the clouds with joy, and while
the let-down afterwards was a bit upsetting at first, that one day of
believing was worth it! It inspires new hope that one day maybe such a find
will be a reality. Meanwhile, if someone should find a bunch of
transcriptions on a March 31, just wait a few days before letting anyone
know.
Bryan Wright
(Who's still up in the clouds over the recent FGRA release of the new
"Little Orphan Annie" shows. I've got those on CD here beside me, so I know
*that* find was no joke!)
--------------------------------
End of [removed] Digest V2003 Issue #143
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