------------------------------
The Old-Time Radio Digest!
Volume 2003 : Issue 155
A Part of the [removed]!
ISSN: 1533-9289
Today's Topics:
New restaurant [ "welsa" <welsa@[removed]; ]
AFRS audiences [ "joe@[removed]" <sergei01@earthli ]
Columbia, the Gem of the Ocean [ Dennis W Crow <DCrow3@[removed] ]
Re: Brains and Buffoonery [ Elizabeth McLeod <lizmcl@[removed] ]
Amos 'n Andy [ "Irene Heinstein" <IreneTH@[removed] ]
AFRS programs [ "joe@[removed]" <sergei01@earthli ]
OLDE TYME RADIO NETWORK Schedule for [ HERITAGE4@[removed] ]
Cincy Con [ Charlie Summers <charlie@[removed] ]
Re: Age and Place [ "Michael Hayde" <mmeajv@[removed]; ]
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 16:39:19 +0000
From: "welsa" <welsa@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: New restaurant
An article in this week's free entertainment newspaper in the Phoenix area
has a review of a new restaraunt. It is called Fibber Magee's. No, that is
not a spelling error. That is the way the restaurant spells it. They call
it an "authentic Irish-owned bar and restaurant.
The article goes to to say, in part: "...the owners designed Fibber
Magee's, which was named after an old Irish radio talk show called Fibber
Magee and Molly," to resemble an authentic Irish pub."
Nice try, but somebody needed to do a bit more research. Talk show?
They are located at 1989 W Eliot Road in Chandler, Arizona.
I already e-mailed the newspaper about this, but I suspect they were only
reporting what they were told.
Ted
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 16:39:42 +0000
From: "joe@[removed]" <sergei01@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: AFRS audiences
I'm listening to an AFRS Command Performance - where did the audience come
from, local servicemen? Civilians? (surely not)
Joe Salerno
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 22:43:42 +0000
From: Dennis W Crow <DCrow3@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Columbia, the Gem of the Ocean
Arthur Emerson writes that, by now, "every red blooded boy or girl" should
have informed me that "Don Winslow of the Navy" was the program that
featured "Columbia, the Gem of the Ocean,"
as its theme.
Thanks, Arthur, but you and Edwin Humphrey, who e-mailed me privately, are
the only ones to respond. I am delighted. I confirmed Edwin's memory by
going to Buxton's early radio guide. Dunning listed the program but not
the theme. My Elderhostel friend will be thrilled at the news.
Hickerson listed two of the shows still surviving---from October, 1942.
I'd sure like to get my hands on one. Unfortunately, I have never heard
the show and would love to listen to one. Anybody out there have a copy?
Dennis Crow
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 22:46:03 +0000
From: Elizabeth McLeod <lizmcl@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Re: Brains and Buffoonery
On 4/12/03 4:58 PM OldRadio Mailing Lists wrote:
>In other words, my thoughts were that in the early episodes the characters
>were portrayed less intelligent than the later ones. I think Elizabeth
>agrees with that and that was the message I was trying to get across.
I *wouldn't* agree with the idea that the characters were being portrayed
as less "intelligent." They were being portrayed as *uneducated* which
is an entirely different matter.
Many people confuse "intelligence" with "education" or "intellectual
refinement," but I strongly disagree with that. It's possible to be
extremely intelligent with very little formal education -- which is
exactly the way in which Correll and Gosden portrayed Amos. He was
clearly a very bright, very intelligent man -- but a bright, intelligent
man who had never had formal schooling. (It was established, in fact,
that Amos taught *himself* to read and write as a child, after the death
of his parents, and this certainly isn't the sign of a character lacking
in brainpower.) Within the first four months of "Amos 'n' Andy," Amos had
been established as an thoughtful, resourceful man who was clearly the
brains of the Fresh Air Taxicab Company, and listeners who regularly
followed the program were able to put into context those occasions when
he admitted he couldn't spell a difficult word.
Amos wasn't the only "intelligent" character. Mr. Taylor stands out -- he
was, in fact, portrayed as *college educated* at a time when only a small
percentage of *any* Americans had that privilege, let alone
African-Americans. His daughter Ruby was attending college in New York,
and subsequently attended nursing school. The teenager Sylvester was
considered one of the most skilled auto mechanics in Chicago -- a skill
which certainly requires intelligence. Brother Crawford was a bright,
well-educated man who excelled in his chosen field of bookkeeping. Henry
Van Porter was a social-climbing snob, but he was also an articulate,
skillful salesman. Roland Weber was a force to be reckoned with in the
oil business. And so [removed]
Indeed, of all the characters in A&A during the serial era, Andy stands
out as the only true bonehead in the group. And even in his case, his
problems stem more from a profound inferiority complex than any real lack
of cognitive ability.
>Elizabeth says that the "inept" type humor faded out after a few years. I
>have no reason to doubt her on that fact. Why that change occured, I dont
>know. My thoughts were that perhaps they felt that joke style wore thin , it
>was a desire to keep the show fresh, or even in time their speaking style
>just evolved. If Elizabeth has some quotes from the creators of the show
>from that period of time on this topic, it would be greatly appreciated.
Here's what Freeman Gosden had to say about this issue, in an interview
published in the August 1930 issue of "Psychology" magazine (one *does*
have to go considerably afield from the usual radio fan magazines in
order to catch the full scope of the impact A&A made at its peak:)
"We don't wisecrack. If we had nothing but wisecracks to rely on, we'd
lose most of our friends. In the first place, we couldn't get enough
wisecracks to go around for three hundred and thirteen nights a year. Not
good ones, anyway. We have to diversify the emotional appeal. A laugh
here, a little pathos there, and some good advice everywhere. The biggest
response from our audience comes from the pathetic and instructive side."
This attitude existed from the beginning of "Sam and Henry" -- in
examining the very first S&H script, from 1/12/26, one is struck by the
fact that it's really just straight dialogue -- no overt jokes at all.
Critics noticed this as something that set "Amos 'n' Andy" apart from any
other "blackface" material they'd ever heard -- and this difference was a
common theme in discussions of the program in a wide range of
publications --
British critic Hubert Foss of "Radio Times" wrote:
"Their nightly 15 minutes is almost indescribable to an English reader,
hardly to be understood to an English listener. There is so little in it
to describe. It is not a joker's act, nor a mere jumble of wisecrack
jokes. The listener laughs, he laughs with a fellow feeling, not as at a
smart saying. Here, in fact, is a serial story, a continued drama in two
simple lives.
-- quoted in Charleston (WV) Daily Mail, 10/5/30.
Columnist/raconteur O. O. McIntyre wrote:
"Read the manuscript of their daily skit and it is the driest of
pointless drivel, and yet in their hands it pulses with pathos, glows
with an understanding sympathy, and you suddenly become conscious that it
is the warp and woof of the phenomena called life. You want to hear
more."
-- Cosmopolitan Magazine, May 1930
Radical Socialist philosopher Maynard Shipley wrote:
"This sort of appeal does not come because, as one recent critic
suggests, a couple of comedians mispronounce all four-syllable words.
American entertainers have before now received five year contracts at
$100,000 a year for very inferior stuff, so that the monetary recompense
is no criterion. But none of the wise-cracking duologuists whom Correll
and Gosden are sometimes charged with imitiating ever attained such
widespread popularity.
"The truth is that these boys do not imitate anybody. Neither do they
wisecrack. Sometimes they say funny things, of course, so do we all, once
at least in a lifetime, say funny things. They are not primarily
comedians: that is the first lesson to be learned by the novice
listener-in.
"What they are doing is simply living, under a slight disguise, the lives
of those who hear them, of their listeners' relatives and friends and
enemies. The astounding virtuosity by which two men can bring a whole
repertory before the microphone -- the instant recognition of the
Kingfish's or Brother Crawford's or Lightning's voice, though we know
that only Amos 'n' Andy themselves are really there -- is of course a
factor in their success; so is the ability (sometimes not so great as it
could be) to weave a story sufficiently simple and yet sufficiently
complicated, with the proper suspense and climaxes, to keep up the
interest of their public. But the real 'sirology' behind the amazing
popularity of this pair is that in their two main characters they are
representing to every fan the two persons he himself knows best --
himself as he believes himself to be, and himself as he cannot help
knowing he really is. "
-- The Debunker, April 1931.
>
>Unfortunately most of the serial episodes that exist are from these first
>few years.
The "wordplay" routines you're referring to were actually much less
common than most people realize. For example, over the 59-episode "Earl
Dixon Affair" storyline of May-July 1929, only three episodes are devoted
primarily to wordplay -- the 6/8/29 episode, in which Andy writes an
overblown letter to John Watkins, husband of his former fiancee Lulu
Parker: the 6/20/29 episode, in which Andy reads the response from
Watkins; and the 7/2/29 episode in which Andy tries to impress Amos with
his knowledge of law.
The impression that this type of material was more frequent than it was
may have something to do with the fact that all three of these episodes
are in circulation. But there were 56 episodes in this storyline in which
wordplay was either a minor, fleeting element in the script or absent
entirely, and many of *these* episodes are *not* in circulation.
Then too, many of the "episodes" which OTR collectors have heard from
this era are in fact *not* episodes at all, but rather
commercially-released Victor phonograph records -- which had nothing to
do with the content of the radio program. The unattributed or
incorrectly-attributed circulation of these recordings (especially "The
Presidential Election") has helped to create the inaccurate assumption
that the early A&A was more jokey than it ever really was.
Correll and Gosden used "wordplay" episodes primarily as a way of
delineating characterization -- especially Andy's arrogant
pretentiousness -- but they also had an essential storytelling function.
They were inserted at key points in the storyline as a way of (1)
stalling for time in order to string out suspense and (2) as a way of
relieving a certain amount of built-up dramatic tension. Correll and
Gosden understood that too much tension had a way of exhausting listeners
-- and used these comedy-relief segments as a deliberate tool for
lightening the mood of the program at strategic points in the story.
>Also she may correct me if Im wrong, but I thought these early
>years were possibly the time when Amos/Andy was most popular (with the Andy
>trial as an example) I know that the shooting of Andy was big (which was
>later) but my thoughts were the times they would close down the theater etc.
>were in those early years.
The peak of A&A's popularity extended from January 1930 thru December
1931. The "craze" began to build in November 1929, with the outcry over
the program's time change, and took on full force with the "Great Home
Bank" storyline in January. From there, the craze picked up the full
force of a national fad, reaching a secondary peak with the breach of
promise trial in February-March 1931, and a tertiary peak with the Jack
Dixon Affair in November-December 1931. The craze didn't begin to really
cool until a series of low-key storylines during the first quarter of
1932. However, A&A remained the most popular program in the 7 pm Eastern
time slot until 1941. (For a documented discussion of A&A's ratings
popularity thruout its history see "Amos 'n' Andy By The Numbers," at
[removed]~[removed])
Elizabeth
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 22:46:28 +0000
From: "Irene Heinstein" <IreneTH@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Amos 'n Andy
I've intended to stay out of this conversation but the discussion has
evolved from an appreciation of what was good about Amos 'n Andy to one in
which some basic issues seem to be ignored, or avoided.
Pretty soon we'll be depicting A+A as a bold step toward racial equality,
which it definitely was not. The truth is that in the American society
of that period blacks could be regarded positively by whites, so long as
they 'stayed in their place' and appeared harmless. It can not be denied
that whites felt superior to blacks. It was insensitive and lazy thinking,
but all too common, and representative of the thinking of the time.
Looking at something in its context is important.
I don't think Gosden and Correll were racists. But they weren't pioneers
of racial equality either. They were very good entertainers intending no
harm. Southerners could enjoy these funny Black characters because they
stayed in their place and were not the threat they were to become in the
Civil Rights Movement. When the real life southern Amos 'n Andys began to
demand integration and equal rights they no longer had a large sympathetic
audience. Amos 'n Andy did not empower the Civil Rights Movement.
Getting past stereotypes is one of the hardest things for every group
seeking equality. While there is a heightened sensitivity which may
appear to be 'over reaction' to some most of us are not in the position to
judge, not having experienced that degree of exclusion.
Don't get me wrong. In real time I always watched Amos 'n Andy on TV and
loved it. When I later viewed it from the perspective of the complaints of
some American Blacks I had to admit to myself there was something to it,
that is when I stopped thinking that the NAACP was a spoilsport with no
sense of humor. I have since listened to the radio programs, enjoy them
tremendously, think they are excellent.
However one of the reasons I can enjoy them is because the stereotypes of
the time are no longer embedded in our society. I can pay attention to the
good writing, the great humor and the character development. It is very
problematic to impose modern thinking on the past. I cringe every time I
see Steppen Fetchit and saddened that he had to demean himself in order to
work. I don't feel that way about Amos 'n Andy.
As I said before, I don't for a moment feel that Gosden and Correll were
racists, but racism was certainly a component of Amos 'n Andy as it was in
the greater society of that time. There's a difference between bigotry and
racism, with the existence of the latter often being denied by good-thinking
people who have no racial prejudice in their hearts, because the word racism
is so misunderstood and so emotionally charged.
But I also don't think Gosden and Correll saw Blacks as equals, most people
didn't at the time, and their knowledge about Blacks came mainly from their
knowledge of black performers they met in vaudeville who often promoted
stereotypes themselves because the audience liked it .
To suggest that the stereotypes presented by Amos 'n Andy were helpful to
blacks is too much of a stretch. Enjoy the humor, as an enlightened,
evolved individual but see it for what it reveals about the society in which
it thrived. It doesn't need to be subjected to a revisionist history
intended to make it politically correct.
At a University of VA website I found a quote from 'Studs Lonigan', by
James Farrell.
"You would have laughed yourself sick at them. They're so much like darkies.
Not the fresh Northern niggers, but the genuine real Southern darkies, the
good niggers, lazy, happy-go-lucky, strutting themselves out in
[removed] like real life."
--Quoted from Studs Lonigan by James T. Farrell
Melvin Ely, a professor of American History at the College of William and
Mary, and a Fulbright Scholar wrote in his book The Adventures of Amos 'n'
Andy: A Social History of an American Phenomenon. New York: The Free Press,
1991.
"But by creating the only radio series that depicted an all-black world,
Gosden and Correll painted themselves into a corner. At first glance, the
radio team's practice of avoiding any hint of unpleasantness between the
races seems an enlightened one--and an easy policy to follow simply by using
almost no white characters. But the result was that virtually all of the
show's countless larcenies and deceptions were committed by blacks against
other blacks. However benign their intentions may have been,..., Amos 'n'
Andy's fans could easily see the series not only as a traditional burlesque
of universal human greed, but also as a portrait of Afro-American character
and communal values. That picture was no compliment to the race"
-Irene
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Apr 2003 09:44:10 +0000
From: "joe@[removed]" <sergei01@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: AFRS programs
I've been listening to a Command Performance ep. Burns & Allen are the
MCs/guests, and they do quite a bit of comedy. So I'm wondering if some of
the material was possibly adapted from their regular show, since the AFRS
material would not be broadcast domestically, or if they created material
for the overseas troops - anybody know?
Joe Salerno
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Apr 2003 09:52:22 -0400
From: HERITAGE4@[removed]
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: OLDE TYME RADIO NETWORK Schedule for
week of: April 13th
Here are the offerings for the OTRN for this week - 24/7 at:
[removed]
SAME TIME, SAME STATION with Jerry Haendiges
1. THE LIFE OF RILEY 9/3/48 "Riley Meets Clem Kadiddlehopper"
with William Bendix and guest, Red Skelton.
2. THE RED SKELTON SHOW 12/10/48 "Clem Kadiddlehopper
Opens the Show" Stars: Red Skelton.
3. HORATIO HORNBLOWER 2/20/53 "Prisoners in 1811"
Starring Michael Redgrave.
4. MEREDITH WILSON'S MUSICAL REVIEW 7/23/40 NBC
Meredith's guests are: Kay St. Germane and Ray Hendricks, with
Cliff Nazzaro.
HERITAGE RADIO THEATRE with Tom Heathwood
1. GUEST: Micheal Hayde, author of "My Name's Friday" - The
Story of DRAGNET.
2. DRAGNET NBC 4/1/50 "The Big Witch" with Jack Webb.
3. RARITIES -- "St. George & The Dragonet" "The Lone Psychiatrist"
and an election bit from 1928 with AMOS & ANDY.
4. THE COLGATE SPORTS NEWSREEL With BILL STERN NBC
Pgm. #482 - 1/21/49 - Guest: Bandleader & Radio Personality,
Horace Heidt.
Enjoy -- Tom & Jerry
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Apr 2003 09:55:49 -0400
From: Charlie Summers <charlie@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: Cincy Con
Folks;
The Cincinnati Old-Time Radio and Nostalgia Convention is over; it was
great having the chance to talk to so many subscribers face-to-face, enjoy
the recreations, and spend too much in the dealer's room. (Ok, ok, maybe
that last wasn't _quite_ as much fun as the [removed] ;)
Bob Hastings looked great, with his new VanDyke, and Hal Stone was
entertaining the group as usual, without having to use even one funny voice
in the recreations. John Rayburn not only performed, but graced us with a
spoonerism. And the new hotel had _plenty_ of room for the attendees.
As far as I can tell, a good time was had by all!
Charlie
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Apr 2003 10:07:40 +0000
From: "Michael Hayde" <mmeajv@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Re: Age and Place
Elizabeth Minney wrote:
Victor Perrin, according to [removed], was born in 1916 and died in
1989. This d'Illyria website lists the following info about him:
Victor Perrin
Born : 6 December 1900 in Clinton, Massachusetts, USA
Died: 30 April 1974 in Rochester, Minnesota, USA of lung cancer.
This d'Illyria site also added several years to Mr. Bartell's age.
To which Harry Bartell replied that Mr. Perrin:
<snip> always thought he was born in Menomonee Falls, Wisconsin although I
don't know the date.
Mr. Bartell also graced us with his exact birthdate. Harry, you have no
one to blame but yourself when your mailbox is filled to overflowing with
cards this November! <vbg>
I haven't seen "This d'Illyria site," but the IMDb appears to have the
correct info for Mr. Perrin's birth date and place, and correctly lists
1913 for Mr. Bartell. However, the site credits Vic Perrin with the role
of "Attorney with eyepatch" in the DRAGNET 1970 episode "[removed] - Night
School" - a role actually played by Harry Bartell!
Harry, the site also indicates that your first and final TV appearances
were under the auspices of Jack Webb. First: "The Big Mother," a DRAGNET
episode from January 1952. Final: the TV Movie "Mobile Two" from 1975, for
which Webb was Executive Producer. Does this coincide with your resume?
Michael
--------------------------------
End of [removed] Digest V2003 Issue #155
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