Subject: [removed] Digest V01 #81
From: <[removed]@[removed]>
Date: 3/11/2001 4:10 PM
To: <[removed]@[removed];

------------------------------


                      The Old-Time Radio Digest!
                         Volume 01 : Issue 81
                   A Part of the [removed]!
                           ISSN: 1533-9289


                           Today's Topics:

 Accuracy in books                    [Alan Chapman <[removed]@[removed]]
 Re: visuals vs. audio?               [Michael Biel <mbiel@[removed];       ]
 staring into the flames              [MoondanceFF@[removed]                ]
 Yellow Wall-Paper                    [neil crowley <og@[removed];     ]
 Progress Marches On, But Can Stumble ["Stephen A Kallis, Jr." <skallisjr@]
 Women and OTR                        ["Merill Barber" <mgbarber@[removed]]
 Tracking Sounds ...                  ["Stephen A Kallis, Jr." <skallisjr@]
 TV as radio                          ["Frank Phillips" <frankphi@hotmail.]
 TV on FM; visual vs. audio           ["Mark Kinsler" <kinsler33@[removed]]
 Small people in the radio            ["Mark Kinsler" <kinsler33@[removed]]
 CBS Radio Mystery Theater            ["Martin Grams, Jr." <mmargrajr@hotm]
 SUSPENSE recommendations             ["Martin Grams, Jr." <mmargrajr@hotm]
 Nick Lucas/ASV Living Era            [Peter Kinder <pdkinder@[removed];    ]
 GREAT RADIO HEROES BOOK              ["stephen jansen" <stephenjansen@ema]

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 15:13:20 -0500
From: Alan Chapman <[removed]@[removed];
To: Old-Time Radio Digest <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  Accuracy in books

Today's New York Times has a wonderful article on the issues and
problems with oral history.  While the article isn't about OTR history
or books, per se, it discusses the very issues that came up on this
list this past week.  Here's the link for those interested:

Prospecting for Truth Amid the Distortions of Oral History
[removed]

Alan Chapman

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 19:30:22 -0500
From: Michael Biel <mbiel@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Re: visuals vs. audio?

George Wagner related:
"Let's view the picture," he said, "until we both agree that
we've lost the plot."  This took less than 30 seconds.

From: MoondanceFF@[removed]
[removed] I preview/judge films for Moondance, I mute the sound
for the first viewing. If I can't follow the plot or enjoy the
visual images without the dialog, I know the film is probably a loser.
--Elizabeth E.

Over the years when reading the descriptions of some made-for-TV movies
of the past I sometimes wonder why they hadn't been sent out for
theatrical release because they seemed to be quite good from the
description.  When actually seeing them, there usually are some dead
giveaways as to what the difference is between a theatrical film and one
made-for-TV even by the same studio.  So much of TV really is
radio-with-pictures.  Like the quote from Linda Ellerbee and Isaac
Asanoff's experiment, you can follow the plot from the next room, but
are at a complete loss if watching without the sound.  A well crafted
movie will provide you with a lot of information in the visual image.
That is what the art of silent movies provided in the era immediately
preceding radio.  I watch a lot of international television.  A lot.
That's part of my job.  But my knowledge of foreign languages is not
very great. Yet quite often I find it easy to enjoy dramas and musicals
even in languages I have no way of understanding.  I certainly don't
know the nuances of the plot but the general action can be followed,
just as in opera.  I'm watching the art of the production.  That is rare
in run-of-the-mill American TV.  I tell my students that there are
mainly two types of films which DEMAND that you watch the screen at all
times--silent films and subtitled (and perhaps non-subtitled) foreign
language films.  This is something regular films and TV should also
strive for.

There is another factor--some of us actually think differently.  I have
a very acute aural memory.  I can remember sounds and music and speech
and run them over in my mind.  But visually I am at a loss.  I can't
remember faces, I can't reconstruct visual images.  A few years ago I
was reading an interview with an artist who expressed just the
opposite.  He was talking about how he is always seeing visual images in
his mind but could not ever remember sounds or music or voices.  He even
went so far as to think that this is how EVERYBODY is.  He said
something like "I can't play back the sound of somebody's voice in my
mind.  Can anyone?  Of course not."  But there are studies that have
been made of brain scans showing that some people are more acute with
visual memory and others with aural memory.  This can explain why some
are more drawn to music and radio and others to art and film.

Michael Biel  mbiel@[removed]

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 19:30:20 -0500
From: MoondanceFF@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  staring into the flames

In a message dated 3/10/01 1:19:58 PM, Stephen A. Kallis, Jr. writes:

<< we're drawn naturally to moving light.  That is why in homes
with fireplaces, or in camps with campfires, especially at night, we find
ourselves staring into the flames.  TV and motion pictures are responses
to that sense; OTR -- or any audio recording or broadcast, for that
matter -- isn't. >>

Ah, [removed] years ago, I designed sustainable habitat for a NASA project
in Antarctica, which I called SAFE-ICE (Space Analog Facility
Experiment-Isolated & Confined Environment). In it, I placed, for
psychological reasons benefitting the residents, a real fireplace, centrally
located in the common room. The scientists summarily rejected the designs,
based on the "silliness" of a fireplace as a genuine primitive need of
stressed-out workers at the end of the long day.

I wonder if the caveman's campfire flickering & story-telling time is
analogous to the way we used to sit around the old radio, intently watching
the glowing gold, flickering [removed]

Cheers!--Elizabeth E.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 19:54:01 -0500
From: neil crowley <og@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Yellow Wall-Paper

From: Alan Bell <bella@[removed];

On another note, I just listened to an episode of Suspense, "The
Yellow Wallpaper," (7-29-48) with Anges Morehead (sp?). It _was_
truly suspensful, even mesmerizing, and yet the ending completely
eluded me.

Try the website:
[removed]~daniel/amlit/[removed]
and you'll learn as much as you want to know about the story. The gist is -
work is better than rest in treating incipient madness. Obviously, the
woman in the story is rested into madness.

"Yellow Wall-Paper" doesn't really grab me, but try Conrad Aiken's often
anthologized short story "Silent Snow, Secret Snow" if you really want to
hear looney tunes.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 20:44:43 -0500
From: "Stephen A Kallis, Jr." <skallisjr@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Progress Marches On, But Can Stumble

Michael Biel, commenting on my observation, "Recording a performance in
any medium is a way to extend its availability for an indefinite time in
the future.  Having been recorded, it's likely to be preserved by
someone: true of any medium," observes,

Oh, sigh.  If only it were true.  It is amazing how many
things--including those that were specifically recorded for posterity--do
not exist.  The turnover of personnel at all types of
organizations often leaves them without the corporate memory that certain
things were expected to be preserved.  Private collections disappear.
Recording media [removed];<

Well, what I meant to imply isn't that recording a performance is a
_guarantee_ that it will be preserved; just that it's a way to preserve
it.  One's chances of winning a lottery are very slight; however, one has
no chance of winning it if one doesn't buy a ticket.  Now Sarah
Barnhart's movie was shot on nitrate film, but I understand was later
transferred to acetate.  Point being that if it hadn't been filmed at
all, there would be absolutely no chance for later generations to have
seen it.  The flip side of things disappearing is that things may also be
uncovered.  But _any_ recording has the potential of being preserved. (On
a different field, a communication written by Archimedes of Syracuse --
arguably one of the three greatest mathematicians in history -- was
discovered in the early 1900s, more than 2,000 years after he wrote it.
The moral: You never can tell.)

It is true that the popularity of videocassettes, LaserDiscs, and now
DVD; and the LP then the CD has led to a resurgence of vault searching
and re-issues and re-releases.  But much had been lost before the search.
<<

Noted.  I am not suggesting that things be _archived_ on videotape.
However, the advent of videotape pulls up stuff that might have
disappeared completely otherwise.  Oddly, videotape creates a financial
incentive to reissue the stuff, which extends its lifespan.  The point is
the buying the lottery ticket: without the ticket, you can't win; with
it, you might.  Thedre is no guarantee.

Stephen A. Kallius, Jr.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 20:44:41 -0500
From: "Merill Barber" <mgbarber@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Women and OTR

  Where has Elizabeth E. been. No women on OTR? I guess I do a lot of
listening though. I was just too curious about ages and asked that question
and got wonderful responses, thanks again.  I still mourn my Frontier Town
fiasco. So busy I still haven't looked for an otr radio station here in the
Seattle area and no one answered if they knew anything.  We gals are here
Elizabeth. Gloria

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 21:56:52 -0500
From: "Stephen A Kallis, Jr." <skallisjr@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Tracking Sounds ...

This is verging on off-topic, but I'll try to steer it back.  About the
"Asimov Test" for TV (and implicationally film), where the dialog is
muted to see whether the storyline can be followed, Elizabeth E. writes,

[removed] I preview/judge films for Moondance, I mute the sound for
the first viewing. If I can't follow the plot or enjoy the visual images
without the dialog, I know the film is probably a [removed];<

There are films where the visual input is necessary.  There was an
espionage film made in the early 1950s that, though a sound film, had not
one word of intelligible dialog.  And it was an effective film.  Some of
Ernie Kovak's routines were effectively silent (save for sound effects
that would mean nothing without the visuals).  Try picking up the
storyline of One Million Years BC starring Raquel Welch with the picture
"muted."  In short, TV and film can be and sometimes are able to have the
images carry the story alone.

As mentioned before, take a really good OTR story and try using the same
dialog in a film or TV show, and in that context, it will usually sound a
little strange, because people ordinarily don't talk that way.  Even
where the dialog is very good (the inverse of that used on the Mr. Keen
show, for example) it would sound unusual carried out in a visual medium.
 (When someone is about to enter a darkened room, he or she might say to
a companion, "Get the light," on an OTR show.  The other might reply, "I
don't find it ,,, ah ... here it is," followed by a "click."  Then the
first says, "Ahh ... that's better."  By contrast, on a TV show, viewers
can see that the room is dark, and the light can be turned on without a
word being spoken.  A whole show with too much dialogue might get on
viewers' nerves.)

Good OTR works in spite of its limitations, through skillful writing and
production.  As I mentioned before, a show like Pat Novak For Hire
wouldn't work well in a medium other than OTR (or as a magazine/book
story).  OTR is a specialty, and the best of it is in a class by itself.

Stephen A. Kallis, Jr.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 22:31:17 -0500
From: "Frank Phillips" <frankphi@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  TV as radio

Dave,

Everyone living near a TV station assigned by the FCC to channel 6 (NOT
channel 6 on cable) can listen to the station on [removed] FM, which is a
harmonic of the sound frequency. I often do so as I drive around, because I
would rather hear a decent TV show or newscast than lousy music!

Frank Phillips
[removed]
[removed]

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 23:07:07 -0500
From: "Mark Kinsler" <kinsler33@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  TV on FM; visual vs. audio

Our local CBS affiliate here in Columbus, OH, broadcasts their TV
programming on FM radio.  Most of the shows are followable (is that a
word?)
and we have often enjoyed TV radio-style while traveling during my kid's
favorite show times.

Well, yes, but before everyone gets excited, I should note that this is kind
of by accident.  I assume that the poster is speaking of Channel 6 in
Columbus, which indeed comes in on FM radio.  That's because the sound
carrier of Channel 6 is located at or near [removed] MHz, which most FM radios
can pick up.  However, [removed] MHz isn't in the official FM band, so the TV
station isn't really making any attempt to communicate via radio.  The
Columbus signal is very clear and strong, and I listen to it as well.

Now, the soap operas I receive when I'm driving between schools in the noble
Geo Metro don't work at all: they apparently rely on visuals more than other
shows, though perhaps they'd be just as obscure with the pictures.

What's particularly interesting, however, is that channel 6 TV news needs no
video whatsoever. In fact, CNN, the all-news cable TV channel,  feeds its
audio signal to many radio stations (KQV in Pittsburgh is one), and while
there's an occasional reference to a picture ("...as you can see, the damage
was quite [removed]") there's not really much that's lost.

The situation in television advertisements is completely the opposite.  I
think it's widely recognized that the best writing and general talent in
video have found their way into national TV advertising.  There are any
number of ads with no sound at all--just background sound effects.  If
you're not watching, you won't understand what's happening.

Ever see a TV ad for a radio station?  They really don't understand TV:
they'll put a still picture, or a spinning CD, on the screen, and talk like
crazy.  Ads for TV shows on radio are typically far better.

M Kinsler

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 23:07:09 -0500
From: "Mark Kinsler" <kinsler33@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Small people in the radio

Perhaps those of us who are older will remember a cartoon in the New Yorker
magazine many years ago, possibly by Chas Addams.  Fellow looks at his radio
over on the table and there, emerging from a little door in the back, are
the tiny musicians with their instrument cases, putting on their tiny hats
and coats as they depart.

M Kinsler

who got distracted by his New Yorker cartoon anthology looking for this (it
wasn't there, but I read through the rest of the book anyway.)

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 23:19:59 -0500
From: "Martin Grams, Jr." <mmargrajr@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  CBS Radio Mystery Theater

Regarding CBS Radio Mystery Theater costs:

Without word from Himan Brown directly (who has often publicly commented
that he has no care for the radio of the past, only of the future), the
actual cost of producing an episode of CBS RMT would be merely a guess.
However . . .

Script writers were paid about $350 per script, regardless of who wrote the
script, which were often written by both radio actors like Ian Martin and
professionals such as Henry Slesar.

The actors were paid only scale: $[removed] per episode (no taxes taken out -
that was up to the actors to report), regardless of who was involved,
whether they were Fred Gwynn or Russell Horton.
The actors never signed any such contract stating they would get royalties
for any future reruns or sale of episodes released commercially.  (Although
if you look back on the series, Sarah Jessica Parker, John Lithgow, Tony
Roberts, Kevin McCarthy, Julie Newmar were a few of the casts - who happened
to be in NY at the time and appeared by invitation.  Amanda Plummer, who I
personally feel is one of the best actresses we have today, even made an
appearance!)

The music was never original - all stock music from CBS's massive libarary.
Himan didn't have to pay a penny for any music used.  I listened to an
episode with Gordon Payton when we drove to the Cincinnati convention two
years ago (the first time I ever heard an episode) and before the hour was
over, I recognized the background music from numerous TV episodes including
Bernard Herrmann, Lucien Moraweck (Twilight Zone scores) and even the Dark
Shadows theme song in one!  I sometimes wonder if the estate of Bernard
Herrmann even got paid for his copyrighted scores being used on the series!
I've been told by friends in Universal City that the Herrmann estate gets
very mean when it comes to unauthorized use of Herrmann's music . . .

[removed] Marshall only showed up once a week to talk into the microphone, for a
week's worth of narrations, which I'm sure, didn't take that long.  We're
only talking five or six narrations per week, so I think it's safe to say he
was paid per visit, not per episode.  Anyone know how much?  I haven't found
any reliable sources yet, and his agent answered every question I asked
except for that.

This kind of gives you an idea of how low the budget was for these episodes
- even for BIG NAME Hollywood stars!

The only other budget I see put into the episodes was for supplies, the one
sound technician, the one (or two, depending on the episode) sound effects
men, and the rental of the studio - if any.  Each episode was rehearsed and
recorded in Studio G on the sixth floor of the old CBS Radio Annex on East
52nd Street (where all the broadcasting companies and museums reside), so I
don't know if he even paid any rental fees.

The budget for CBS Radio Mystery Theater, I think, was a lot lower than
quoted in that Variety article.  If not, where did the rest of the $[removed]
budget go to??

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 00:09:59 -0500
From: "Martin Grams, Jr." <mmargrajr@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  SUSPENSE recommendations

Regarding Alan's question about little-regarded episodes that are worth
listening to . . .

THE TRAP  June 16, 1949 with Agnes Moorehead - one of the creepiest
     episodes of the series, yet many people are not familair with it!
RETURN TO DUST  February 1, 1959 with Dick Beals - this is a one-man
     performance that is a tour-de-force.  A MUST!
THE BLACK DOOR  November 19, 1961 - very scary with the lights out.
THE BULLET  December 29, 1949 - has some suspense to it, living up to
     the name of the series.
DEATH ON MY HANDS  May 10, 1951 with Phil Harris and Alice Faye.
     If not suspenseful, you have to admit it's one of the best scripts
     ever written, and even earned the writer a few assignments for
     big-screen movies as a result!
THE WRECK OF THE OLD '97  March 17, 1952  with Frank Lovejoy.
     All I can say is WOW!  What a wonderful mixture of music and drama!

Of course, there are over 900+ episodes of this series available so every
fan and listener probably has their own favorites.  I didn't bother
mentioning "Ghost Hunt" or "House in Cypress Canyon" since I'm assuming
everyone else knows about those.  But if you've never heard of these six,
they come highly recommended.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 00:36:14 -0500
From: Peter Kinder <pdkinder@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Nick Lucas/ASV Living Era

	In his interesting post on Nick Lucas, Michael Biel mentions a CD on
ASV Living Era.  If you have any interest in historic recordings, you owe it
to yourself to check this company out. [removed] You can get some of
their recordings at HMV and Tower records.  They're usually in the $10-13
range -- a terrific bargain for cds of this type, and an extraordinary one
for imports.

	I'm a great fan of ASV/Living Era.  I have perhaps 40 of their CDs,
ranging from obscure western singers, such as Carson Robison (mainly from
British radio shows), to Western stars, such as Gene Autry, to Johnny Mercer
covers by various artists, to British stars, such as Vera Lynn and Anne
Sheldon, and "greatest hit" packages for the 30s and [removed]

	In my experience, few CDs of this type are produced with any
overarching thought.  In contrast, the Living Era sets seem to have been put
together by people who really want you to share their enthusiasm for the
artist.  The two Autry CDs -- especially "The Last Roundup" ADA 5264 -- are
brilliantly organized and stand as a rebuke to the people who put together
the altogether awful Rhino set.

	It's as if the Living Era cds were put together by really
knowledgeable djs.  I just wish they included their commentary.  Even
material you think you know -- Vera Lynn, the Carter Family -- somehow seems
fresher in their juxtapositioning of recordings.

	BTW, apropos of an earlier thread, they offer a Kenny Baker cd, too.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 07:41:22 -0500
From: "stephen jansen" <stephenjansen@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  GREAT RADIO HEROES BOOK

I posted a few days ago about the new release of the book "The Great Radio
Heroes" by Jim Harmon.  This is the revised edition, however, I do not have
the original 1967 copy to compare this to.  So, just some general info about
the book:
246 pages, softcover, McFarland & Co publishers, forewards by Frank Bresee
and Richard A Lupoff.  18 Chapters featuring  I Love A Mystery, Gangbusters,
The Shadow, scary shows, comic book heroes, Tom Mix, Radio Premiums,
Detectives, Newsmen, soap opera heroes, Lone Ranger, Sgt Preston, Green
Hornet, Capt Midnight, Jack Armstrong, comedy heroes, american indian
heroes, and more mysteries by Morse.  Many chapters end with a half-page of
"notes".  There is a 4-page "afterward", about the state of radio drama
nowadays.  There is a one-page bibliography, and a 12-page index with very
small print, that seems to be VERY complete.  26 black-and-white
photographs.  $35 well-spent!

--------------------------------
End of [removed] Digest V01 Issue #81
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