Subject: [removed] Digest V01 #29
From: <[removed]@[removed]>
Date: 1/26/2001 9:36 AM
To: <[removed]@[removed];

------------------------------


                      The Old-Time Radio Digest!
                         Volume 01 : Issue 29
                    A Part of the [removed]!


                           Today's Topics:

 AM antennas and war bonds            ["Mark Kinsler" <mkinsler1@earthlink]
 You Bet Your Life                    ["Art Shifrin" <goldens2@[removed]]
 Re: Pranks                           [Al Girard <agirard@[removed]]
 Ages                                 ["Kevin Pearson" <ktrek@[removed]]
 Email address for Bob Burchett       ["Harry Machin, Jr." <harbev5@earthl]
 Groucho                              [JimInks@[removed]                    ]
 Age, etc.                            ["H. K. Hinkley" <hkhinkley@[removed]]
 Ages                                 ["Tricia Grattan" <tgrattan@teluspla]
 Vintage microphones                  ["Andrew Emmerson" <midshires@[removed]]
 Ages                                 ["Brian Johnson" <CHYRONOP@worldnet.]
 Re: My age                           [Jshnay1@[removed]                    ]
 Re: Age and OTR                      [Elizabeth McLeod <lizmcl@[removed]]
 YBYL as literature                   [John Henley <jhenley@[removed]]
 Tom Mix                              ["Jerry Bechtel" <[removed]@jal.]
 Bob Bailey                           ["Bob Burchett" <haradio@[removed]]
 Groucho on cue                       [otrbuff@[removed]                   ]

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 21:51:39 -0500
From: "Mark Kinsler" <mkinsler1@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  AM antennas and war bonds

2)  I have what is charmingly called a 'garden-level' apartment - which
means it is half underground.  My very expensive receiver / tuner /
surround
sound processor with powered antenna can't get a radio station tuned in to
save it's life.  Nothing but static, while my $15 clock-radio alarm clock
tunes in stations crystal clear.  Could some of the more technically
oriented members explain what's going on?

Your expensive surround-sound receiver's powered antenna knows nothing of
535-1700kHz, the frequencies on which AM is broadcast.  It's strictly a VHF
antenna, optimized for 88MHz to 108MHz FM radio stations.  In fact, it's
probably not even hooked up to your receiver's AM antenna terminal.  The
important thing is to find out what, if anything, _is_ hooked up to the AM
antenna terminal, which you'll find on the back of the receiver.  If
there's a funny-looking coil of insulated wire there, see if you can
manipulate it to improve reception.  My guess, however, is that there's
nothing attached at all.  This eventuality takes us into the world of
long-wire antennas, and that's what you should initially try: find a long
piece of wire, strip the insulation off of one end, and connect it to the
AM antenna terminal.  How long should it be?  Theoretically, as long as
possible: a couple of hundred feet wouldn't be too bad.  Failing that,
there are lots of tricks, each as old as Amos 'n' Andy.

a) Run a wire from the radio's antenna terminal to a telephone line.  The
old trick was to connect the wire to the metal finger-stop on the telephone
dial, and this worked fine as long as it was 1958.  Most phones today don't
have any exposed metal parts, so do your best.  Connecting to any metal
part of a telephone's chassis connects your antenna to your building's
telephone wiring.

b) For the more adventurous, you do the same thing with an electric outlet.
This isn't as difficult as you'd imagine: you interpose a capacitor ([removed]
microfarad, 600 volts is a good rating) between the power line and your
antenna terminal.  This lets you use power wiring as an antenna.  Old radio
kits used to come with a setup to do this.

c) And there are about a million others, mostly to be found in radio
enthusiast magazines from the 1930's.  These can be found in the periodical
collections of big libraries and they're great fun to read.

War bonds were essentially the same as US Savings Bonds.  Every government
and political entity on earth uses bonds of some sort to finance its
operations, either for war or peace.  In general, you buy a bond for less
than its face value: you'd pay, say, $[removed] for a $[removed] bond.
The government would use your money to fly Bob Hope around and, when
Victory came, you'd get the full $[removed] back.  The patriotic folks who
bought German and Japanese war bonds found out what happens when Victory
doesn't come: they never saw a nickel of their money again.

During WWII and probably before, you could buy fractional-value war bonds
known as War Stamps.  This was handy because your average patriot in the
early '40's was pretty near broke: my parents sure were.  The government
sold War Stamps in schools.  Scout troops would help sell them.

M Kinsler


512 E Mulberry St Lancaster OH 43130
740-687-6368
[removed]~kinsler

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 22:45:58 -0500
From: "Art Shifrin" <goldens2@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  You Bet Your Life

There's a photo showing the set with a transparency projector set up to feed
Julius wise cracks that staff would be coming up with during the filming /
taping.  I have several uncut versions in which retakes are done, not only
by Julius, but also by the contestants, who were coached by John Gudel.

It's my impression that a considerable amount of each  YBYL was scripted or
unambiguously blocked out.  In my opinion it was the content of the  writing
and plot lines of the former series that resulted in Groucho's failures on
radio prior to this wonderful long run.  Meaning, they weren't failures
because they weren't replete with ad libs: they were failures because they
were poorly thought out and poorly written.

And remember to ask you Chrysler / Plymouth dealer to show you the new
DeSoto!

Shiffy

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 22:46:01 -0500
From: Al Girard <agirard@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Re: Pranks

Richard  Pratz asks about pranks.  I know Richard quite well, as we
both worked at the same station. He was a radio newsman and I was a
television cameraman.

I was sent on an assignment to a nearby arena where hockey players were
practicing for a summer league.  It was mid-July, and as I left the
arena
to head back to the station I paused at a huge pile of ice-shavings
that had been dumped by the Zamboni.  I made a large snowball and when
I arrived at the newsroon, Michelle (I won't give her last name, but
Richard knows who I mean) was on the air reading the hourly newscast.
I opened the door to the booth and rolled the snowball across her desk.
Michelle, who has a terrific sense of humor, just about fell on the
floor in laughter.  I don't know if she had hit the pause button before
laughing, but I seriously doubt if she had enough time to do so.

I didn't expect such a reaction, and for the rest of the day I was
fearful that a manager had been listening to the newscast.

Al Girard

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 23:36:13 -0500
From: "Kevin Pearson" <ktrek@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  Ages

Hi everyone!
I just want to say that I'm new to the list and a recent rediscoverer of
OTR. I'm 44 year young and when I listen to these old shows they make me
feel younger. I first discovered OTR at about the age of 11 or 12 when I
aquired a crystal radio. I would lay in bed til 12:00 or 1:00 in the morning
(needing to get up for school in the morning, My parents would have killed
me had they ever [removed] wonder I had trouble staying awake in school.),
with my ground attached to the steel frame of my bed. I lived in Wisconsin
and would recieve stations from new Orleans, Chicago and sometimes New York
( actually everywhere). I would carefully move the plunger ever so slightly
to pick up whatever sounds I may happen to find. I loved radio and always
wanted to be in radio but have never been able to fulfil my dream. As I was
saying I would hear the Shadow and CBS Mystery Theater and even Wolfman Jack
playing all the big hits. I have listened to OTR whenever I happened to run
across it on the air but I'm thankful for highspeed internet and the freedom
it gives to DL or listen at your own convenience to these great shows. I
have to say I really enjoy the list and the comments by everyone on here.
It's obvious to me that OTR has not only people who are passionate about
their hobby but love helping others get involved as well. You can count on
me sticking around as long as the list is here. My biggest problem now is
finding storage for all the great shows I'm collecting. In just a month I
think I've aquired close to 500 shows. My hard drive is getting eaten up
quickly. I'm contemplating either installing a 2nd HD (80 gig) or investing
in a CDR/RW and some discs. Any opinions? Well thanks for listening to me
ramble on. BTW my wife is getting interested in OTR as well. She probably
just listens because she loves me so and wants to be wherever I am but I
figure the exposure never hurts anyone *smile*. Happy listening!
Kevin

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 00:55:56 -0500
From: "Harry Machin, Jr." <harbev5@[removed];
To: "Old Time Radio" <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  Email address for Bob Burchett

My thanks to Bob Burchett to responding to my
request for information about the Tom Mix show.
I need his email address to reply to him.

I have heard from five persons about Tom Mix and
each one had something different to tell me.  I'm in
their debt.

Regards,

Harry

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 00:55:54 -0500
From: JimInks@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Groucho

As George Fenneman said in an interview (I might fudge a word or two from
this TV interview), "I don't know why, but some people keeping trying to
prove our show was scripted. Well, If you've ever worked with amatuers, you
know you don't give them a script the night before and expect them to
memorize it."

There was a TV special a few years back that showed how You Bet Your Life
worked.  They did have some material worked out for Groucho in case he needed
it but the show was not scripted.  The producers used (off camera) a screen
and on that screen someone would get messages to Groucho during the taping.
For instance, if Groucho got too far off on a tanget, someone would write a
message and it'd be projected on that screen: "Ask her where she met her
husband," or something like that. This was to save money because they were
using 35 millimeter film and they were trying to keep costs down as well as
keep the show moving along.

The contestants were interviewed by the staff and they'd let Groucho know
about something that would be funny on air, but that'd be about the extent of
it. The contestants were coached only to the extent that the staff might say,
"Remember to tell Groucho that funny story you just told me."  No set up
lines or other kinds of material were written for them.

Now Groucho was sometimes told a contestant would have a funny story and at
times, an "ad lib" might be suggested to Groucho. But he didn't have to use
it as he was free to say whatever it was he wanted.  The shows were about 45
minutes long and cut down to about the 26 best minutes.

While Groucho might have had a little help, he still did a LOT of ad libbing
and from the way I've understood things, what I've described doesn't sound
like a scripted show to me. It sure bothered Fenneman that there were people
who believed it was.


-Jim Amash

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 00:55:52 -0500
From: "H. K. Hinkley" <hkhinkley@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Age, etc.

It has been interesting to read the age and "how I started in OTR"
stories from several of you folks.  I lurk a lot on this list, learning
and marveling at all the accumulated knowledge, wisdom, and insights that
are presented.  Thanks to all!

I am 63 (10-26-37) and remember sitting next to the old round-top as a
boy ready to put a finger on the aerial screw in the back to improve
reception.  My family lived in southern Illinois, 100 miles from the
largest city (St. Louis) so reception was iffy.  Turning the dial rapidly
from KSD to WWL to WOAI, etc., one could keep up with NBC programs in
spite of static and fading.

Soon after moving to northern Illinois in 1967, I discovered a station in
Rockford that played a couple of hours of OTR each week.  I copied them
on my Ampex at 1-7/8 ips which was my first mistake though I could fill a
reel with 12 hours of programs.  Then over the years I discovered traders
and vendors and ran out of shelf space with about 700 reels.  I think I
have every Fibber McGee that exists and have been adding to the Jack
Benny collection lately.

OK, that's more than you ever wanted to know, so it's back to lurk mode
for me.

HK Hinkley, now wintering in the Rio Grande Valley, Texas.  Anyone else
down here?

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 10:34:27 -0500
From: "Tricia Grattan" <tgrattan@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  Ages

Interesting to read this thread.

I'm 25, and have been listening to OTR since I discovered it on a local
radio station when I was 16.  Since then, it's been a rare night when I
haven't fallen asleep listening to an Old Radio Show (they air at 11pm just
as I am going to bed).

I find that I like the mystery/suspense/sci-fi shows the best; most of the
comedies that they air haven't aged as well, IMHO (with the very notable
exception of Jack Benny, whom I very much enjoy).  It has been in reading
this group that I have discovered how many OTR shows I have never heard, I
guess due to the local station not airing them ([removed] I've never heard a Phil
Harris/Alice Faye show).  I'm glad to keep discovering more that I like
about OTR.

Tricia

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 10:58:48 -0500
From: "Andrew Emmerson" <midshires@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  Vintage microphones

I have to say that these command high prices these days, so much so that
some of the classic radio studio microphones are being reproduced (I
presume under licence).

The following deal in this kind of thing:
AUDIO TOYSHOP, Bristol (011 44 117-946 7711, fax 011 44 117-973 0503) sells
classic valve studio microphones (at pro prices). Specialist in all tube and
esoteric [removed] [removed]  , e-mail
toyboys@[removed]. Toyshop Forum section for you to voice your
opinion on whatever you fancy (within reason!) Forums currently active
include: Vintage gear, Modern gear, Neve gear, Technical questions, Old
Pants etc. Have a peek at: [removed]
and blurt it [removed]

CLASSIC ELECTRONICS, Los Angeles, Ca, (818-992 0999, fax  818-340 4331).
Claims huge selection of vintage microphones and recording equipment.

FUNKY JUNK, 505 Liverpool Road, London, N7 8NS (011 44 20-7609 5479).
Recording studio equipment, mainly new but some vintage, all at pro prices.

HARBORSOUND, 180a Central Street, Saugus, Mass, 01906 (617-231 0095, fax
617-231 0295). Vintage microphones, consoles, recorders.

The MIC SHOP (615-595 1717, fax 1 615-595 1718). Tube microphones bought,
sold and serviced.

MISTY HILL AUDIO (512-338 6777). Vintage Neumann microphones, Neve and
Studer equipment.

Olaf PRINZ, Kurfürstenring 27, D-46483 Wesel, Germany (011 49 282-31187, fax
011 49 281-71724). Buy/sell microphones and recording equipment 1920s-1970s.

VINTAGE KING AUDIO (313-965 0645, fax 313-964 3338). Vintage microphones and
studio equipment.

Walter TURNER, 2416 Centaurus Drive, Garland, TX 75044 (972-824 6945).
Replacement ribbons for velocity (ribbon) microphones.

WESTERN VINTAGE MICROPHONES, Russia (tel/fax 011 7 095-299 1161). Vintage
Russian valve microphones.

You could also scan eBay ([removed]) and get their personal shopper
facility to alert you when a mike comes up.

Andy Emmerson.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 10:58:51 -0500
From: "Brian Johnson" <CHYRONOP@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  Ages

If I could have a little clarification [removed] are we talking about how old
we are chronologically? Or how old do we FEEL?

I am 41 and have always been a big history buff. My father never talked a
lot about his Navy days in WWII but my mother would wax eloquently about her
life in the defense plant. (She worked in quality control at the Hoover
Vaccuum Company in North Canton, OH where they shelved making home
appliances in favor of tracer bullets!) When I was about 14 I checked out a
couple of Fibber McGee tapes from our local library and I was hooked. More
than that, it gave my mother and I something else to connect with.

My collection (and interest) waned until I discovered the binary groups and
the wonders of MP3. Now its strictly MWP - My Wife's Problem. ("Why is
taking so long to get my E-Mail?! Are you downloading more radio shows?!?")

But when my kids get to 20th Century history in school, they're going to
have one helluva multimedia presentation!

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 10:38:11 -0500
From: Jshnay1@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Re: My age

I'm 65, and have been collecting OTR at a slow but steady pace for the last
30 years.
I grew up with radio in the 1940s, and recall going to sleep at night in
Chicago with sounds of radio. Radio gave me my first view of the outside
world. I evolved patterns of listening that I can still recall to this day.
Through radio I also became interested in music -- first classical music and
then jazz through themagical "12:60 Club" with a young Dave Garroway.
Radio also influenced my life choices. When I was 12 or 13 I recall being
fascinated by the broadcast of the play "The Front Page". I wanted to be a
newspaperman and spent 42 years as a reporter and editor on various papers
including 30 with The Chicago Tribune.
I renewed my interest in radio during the late 1960s and shortly after that
began collecting and trading for radio programs on rtr. After 30 years, I
accumulated more than 15,000 programs and will probably pend the next 30
years rescuing these programs from bad tape to minidiscs or their successors.
 My collecting tastes are wide-ranging.  I have a great many news and special
events broadcasts, perhaps more than 90 percent of all the Jack Benny
programs that are available, and am missing about 20 Suspense programs from
completing the "set." Our two children both grew up listening to otr tapes --
their favorite program seemed to be Charlie McCarthy.
I also have a large music collection (mostly classical on LP and CD) as well
as various collections of  big band, swing and jazz.
So you can see that radio helped shaped my life and tastes.
jerry shnay

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 10:38:13 -0500
From: Elizabeth McLeod <lizmcl@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  Re: Age and OTR

I'm 38, and have been collecting, studying, and documenting OTR for 24 of
those years. I discovered radio not thru dramatic programming at all --
but by listening to baseball broadcasts with my grandmother (baseball
being a major interest for many older women here in New England). I soon
progressed to dial-twisting, and discovered reruns of various OTR shows
-- which caught my attention, given that I had already developed an
interest in the popular culture of the depression and war years. NBC's
50th Anniversary series in the fall of 1976 was a major catalyst for my
interest in OTR -- and the following year I began acquiring tapes. I've
been at it ever since. (Although I do digitial mastering of
transcriptions for the First Generation Radio Archives, I still do most
of my personal collecting in analog formats.)

I started to specialize early on -- my major interest soon became radio
of the 1930s, and I've emphasised that area in my collecting: probably
half my collection pre-dates 1940. My specific interest in "Amos 'n'
Andy" grew out of my interest in Depression radio -- and I was made even
more curious about this series by the fact that the occasional reruns I
was hearing on Boston radio c. 1978 didn't match the accounts of the
original series that I was hearing  from people who had lived thru the
early 1930s. Of such simple questions are long-term research projects
[removed]

The most fascinating thing about OTR for me? The fact that there is
always something unknown waiting to be discovered if you're willing to
dig for it.

Elizabeth

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 10:38:16 -0500
From: John Henley <jhenley@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  YBYL as literature

Mr Ross asked:
TV Guide this week says that Groucho Marx's "You Bet Your Life" was mostly
[removed]
I thought the idea of the show was that Groucho had failed on
radio before, doing scripts, and that this show was designed to take
advantage of his ability to wisecrack.
Does anyone have any idea just how much of "You Bet Your Life" was
scripted and how much was ad libbed?

This story is told pretty much in full in the out-of-print
book "The Secret Word is Groucho," written by Hector Arce
with input from an 85-year-old Groucho.
As I recall:  While producer John Guedel always said
he got the idea while watching Groucho and Bob Hope
ad lib on an unnamed show, atop the script they'd tossed
on the floor, the practical requirements of staging a quiz show
that would fit into the time slot (and be acceptable to
a sponsor) meant that much of it needed to be written.
Robert Dwan and Bernie Smith would select contestants,
interview them and glean some facts, then prepare some
questions and some remarks for Groucho.  These would
be placed on a monitor that was visible only to Groucho,
and he could select which if any of the wisecracks to use.
He was free to add his own, but everything was eligible for
trimming in post-production.

Part of Groucho's job, then,  was to insert the questions
and chosen scripted remarks into seemingly natural spots
of the conversation.  Dwan, like others had done before him,
said this was the talent of Groucho's that impressed him most -
his ability to speak written lines  as if he'd just thought of them.
(Sometimes, especially right before he proceeds to the quiz,
it's more obvious that he's reading.)

On balance, it seems to me, in a typical YBYL about 50-75% of the
"personal" questions are scripted, and the truly spontaneous
ad-libs amount to about a quarter to a third of all the wisecracks.

It's not really correct to say the whole show was written, but it's
probably closer to the truth than the claim it was all ad-libbed.


John Henley
jhenley@[removed]
ph  (512) 495-4112
fax (512) 495-4296

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 10:38:18 -0500
From: "Jerry Bechtel" <[removed]@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Tom Mix

I echo Harry Machin's comment exactly! Although a mere 64, I was an
ardent fan of Tom Mix. Now that I've started to relive "those thrilling
days of yesteryear" I can't find any Tom Mix shows. There doesn't seem
to be a lot of Captain Midnight available either. In the Philadelphia
area during the '40's, the 5 pm to 6 pm time slot was almost sacred time
for listening to Terry and the Pirates, Superman, Captain Midnight and
last Tom Mix. Then came the T word.

Jerry B.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 10:47:53 -0500
From: "Bob Burchett" <haradio@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Bob Bailey

Darrell Davis wants articles on actor Bob Bailey
and Jackson Beck. I would like to have them also.
The 13 years of the printed Old Time Radio Digest
we have never had anyone send in articles on
either actor.
Darrell's email address is: kgdg@[removed]
Bob Burchett

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 11:33:18 -0500
From: otrbuff@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Groucho on cue

A. Joseph Ross asks about Groucho Marx's "You Bet Your Life," inquiring
how much of the show was scripted and how much ad-libbed.  This area is
covered in my forthcoming book, "The Great Radio Audience Participation
Shows," to be released by McFarland later this year.

Early in the series' radio days, the formerly chaotic comic's penchant
for breaking up audiences with contemptuous gibes in theaters and movies
simply wasn't happening in the broadcast studio.  Producer John Guedel
realized that he must take drastic steps to improve the situation at once
or see his fledgling, floundering quiz show go down the drain.  To fix it
he determined that the quiz segments would be performed in an essentially
no-nonsense manner.  The host would never meet his guests in advance and
would be given only minimal data about each one (perhaps an occupation,
hometown, a unique hobby or interest or possibly an unusual name, and
little more).  Finally, gagwriters would be hired to augment the host's
repertoire of seemingly endless jokes.

"Groucho was fast and funny . . . but hardly fail-safe," radio author
Gerald Nachman explained, "and he felt better going into battle with a
few ripostes up his sleeve."  To implement that feat without giving it
away, Guedel had cue cards printed and projected onto a screen situated
above Marx.  While it appeared to studio (and later, television)
audiences during a big laugh onstage that the emcee was demurely gawking
into space, his head tilted slightly heavenward, he was really receiving
more from upstairs than the uninitiated knew:  Marx was getting his next
ad-lib from on high, thus being guided -- joke by joke -- through the
entire show!

To answer Joe Ross's question, the majority of both the radio and
television versions were fully scripted.

Before this show, Marx had maintained a strong avowed preference for
ad-libbing.  In an interesting anecdote, Leonard Maltin shares a
perceptive tale in which Marx's predilection appears compromised on at
least one occasion.  It concerns an encounter Marx had with Jack Benny's
gagwriters, when Marx was about to make a guest appearance on Benny's
show.  Sent in advance by Benny to Marx's home to let him see the script,
the scribes returned to report that Marx was characteristically caustic
and unreceptive to their overtures.  "Well, we won't use him, then," was
Benny's response, defending his staff's work to the max.

Some years later the two comedians met at a local country club.  Marx
asked Benny why he never had him on his show.  Benny replied:  "I'd be
happy to have you on my show, but only if you use the script my writers
write for you."  Marx agreed and appeared the following week, presumably
reading his lines exactly as written, in obvious contrast to his
passionate fondness for ad-libs.

It would appear that, while that was Marx's preference, when he had to
produce throwbacks in rapid-fire succession every week, he -- and his
whole show ("You Bet Your Life")  -- depended on all the help he could
get.  He wasn't just gazing at the ceiling like we thought he was!

Jim Cox

--------------------------------
End of [removed] Digest V01 Issue #29
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