Subject: [removed] Digest V2001 #260
From: "OldRadio Mailing Lists" <[removed]@[removed];
Date: 8/11/2001 3:03 PM
To: <[removed]@[removed];

------------------------------


                            The Old-Time Radio Digest!
                              Volume 2001 : Issue 260
                         A Part of the [removed]!
                                 ISSN: 1533-9289


                                 Today's Topics:

  Rio Volt                              [ danhughes@[removed] ]
  Parley Baer                           [ danhughes@[removed] ]
  "The Clock"                           [ dabac@[removed] ]
  KSFO recording                        [ bruce dettman <bdettman@[removed] ]
  second careers                        [ Alan Chapman <[removed]@verizon. ]
  Re: Meet Don Lee                      [ Elizabeth McLeod <lizmcl@[removed] ]
  MP3/Apex 500                          [ "Philip Railsback" <philiprailsback ]
  Radio+TV stereo sound                 [ leemunsick@[removed] ]
  Re:MP3/Apex 500                       [ Charlie Summers <charlie@[removed] ]
  stereo tv & radio                     [ "Frank Phillips" <frankphi@hotmail. ]
  TV Stereo Sound                       [ Michael Biel <mbiel@[removed]; ]
  Last of the Calling All Cars Players  [ Conrad Binyon <conradab@[removed] ]
  Re: Stereo Radio and TV               [ Fred Berney <berney@[removed]; ]
  Re: Radio Expressions                 [ Fred Berney <berney@[removed]; ]

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2001 16:19:31 -0400
From: danhughes@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Rio Volt

I said,

And the search continues for an MP3 CD player that
can handle our OTR CDs.

And Mario answered,

 > The search has ended (quite a while ago, actually).
Get a RioVolt. It's by far the best right now for OTR.

What I MEANT to say was, "the search continues for an MP3 CD player that
can handle OTR MP3s for under a hundred dollars."

I have heard good things about the Rio Volt, but I have also heard
several people who said they had a lot of repair problems.  Several Rio
Volts are listed for sale on Ebay at any given time, and many of the used
ones have problems.

---Dan

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2001 16:19:33 -0400
From: danhughes@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Parley Baer

My daughter just ran into the room to tell me that she just saw a
commercial for Parley Baer on the cable TV channel TVLand.  Anybody else
seen this?  I'd sure like to get a video copy of it!

---Dan

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2001 18:21:48 -0400
From: dabac@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  "The Clock"

Would anyone know whether there were two versions made of this series?
The reason I`m asking is that a couple of the programs I have listened
to seem to have a decidedly british tone.
Dan

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2001 18:21:52 -0400
From: bruce dettman <bdettman@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  KSFO recording

August 10, 2001

When I was a kid San Francisco radio station KSFO put out a record of
various comedy moments that occurred during broadcasts. The flip side
was KSFO themes played over the years. Jack carny, Al Collins and Don
Sherwood were featured. I had this for years and then it disappeared
during a move. When Sherwood died in the 1980s and KSFO devoted an
entire weekend to his memory they played the whole record but I had no
tape machine handy at the time.

Anyone out there have a copy of this?

Thanks in advance.

Bruce Dettman

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2001 18:22:07 -0400
From: Alan Chapman <[removed]@[removed];
To: Old-Time Radio Digest <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  second careers

Doug Leary wrote:
This sort of reminded me of Paul Winchell, who after an
established career as a performer went through medical
school and became a surgeon.

Not exactly.  This is from Paul's offical bio
<[removed];:

Paul Winchell was born in New York on December 21, [removed] He attended
Columbia University in 1959 and became a Doctor of Acupuncture after
graduating from The Acupuncture Research College. In 1974, Dr.
Winchell was honored by The National Christian University and is a
practicing Doctor of Divinity.

Alan Chapman

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2001 18:21:57 -0400
From: Elizabeth McLeod <lizmcl@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  Re: Meet Don Lee

Ted wonders,

But my real question is this--at the end, the announcer says:  "This is the
Mutual Don Lee Network."  What was that?  Who was Don Lee?

Don Lee was a Los Angeles businessman who became quite wealthy in the
early 1920s as the West Coast distributor for the Cadillac Motor Car
Company, and he branched into radio in the latter half of the decade by
purchasing stations KHJ in Los Angeles and KFRC in San Francisco. In
December 1928, he connected these stations with a group of California
stations owned by the McClatchy newspaper chain, and formed the
modestly-named Don Lee Broadcasting System.

Lee formed an alliance with CBS in 1929, and became the exclusive
Columbia franchisee west of the Rockies. CBS had no West Coast affiliates
in this era other than the Don Lee Network itself, and picked up
occasional Don Lee features for national distribution, notably
"California Melodies" and the "Sunkist Musical Cocktail." Lee also
continued a monumental "my tower's taller than yours" feud with Earle C.
Anthony, the Los Angeles Packard distributor who owned stations KFI and
KECA, a conflict which led to a constant game of one-upsmanship between
the two magnates.

In 1934, Don Lee died of a heart attack at the age of 53, and the company
was taken over by his son Thomas L. "Tommy" Lee, who immediately got into
a power struggle with CBS-New York over time clearance issues, and began
pushing for more regional autonomy. In 1936, Lee finally refused to renew
the CBS contract, and CBS had to buy KNX in order to insure its continued
presence in the LA-Hollywood market. Lee went on to write his own deal
with Mutual, an arrangement which made the Don Lee Network the exclusive
MBS representative in the West, and which allowed him maximum flexibility
for local programming. In fact, only about 20 per cent of the Don Lee
schedule consisted of Mutual programs -- the rest of the schedule was
made up of regional features.

Tommy Lee was very interested in television, and actually beat RCA/NBC to
the punch in inaugurating a regular program schedule -- his father had
put experimental station W6XAO on the air in 1931. The station adopted
the Farnsworth electronic system in 1932, at a time when most
experimental stations were still using the mechanical process. By 1936
the station was on the air on a daily basis transmitting all-electronic
441-line pictures from film three years before RCA would begin its
regular telecasting schedule in New York, and by 1938, the station was
regularly producing its own live programming. In 1940, an enormous tower
was constructed for W6XAO on Mount Lee (named after Tommy himself)
overlooking Hollywood. The station went commercial as KTSL after the war,
and was sold to CBS in 1951. It is now KNXT.

In 1951, Lee sold the radio network to General Teleradio Inc, a
subsidiary of General Tire, and retired from broadcasting. General
continued to operate the network under the Don Lee name into the
mid-fifties.

Elizabeth

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2001 18:55:38 -0400
From: "Philip Railsback" <philiprailsback@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  MP3/Apex 500

I just bought an Apex 500 last night. I had read a number of good reviews of
this DVD player (particulaly at [removed], where consumers rate and
discuss products.  Very neat site), but your message finalized it for me.
So far I'm quite happy with it, especially considering the $98 price tag.
As far as MP3s go, one disc played fine, one didn't.  I have no idea what
the problem is.  Maybe the Apex didn't like the 700mb size.  I'll try some
more discs later.

There seems to be a small cult around the Apex 500. I think you might be
interested in this page devoted to the Apex and what you can do with it:

[removed]

By the way, where do you get VCDs?  Thanks.

  - Philip

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2001 22:27:23 -0400
From: leemunsick@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Radio+TV stereo sound

Tom Barnett wonders if his pappy was fibbing when describing stereo sound
accomplished by having a radio station on the radio and a TV channel on the
tube at the same time.  Yes, [removed], Tom, it's true.  Still is.  In New
York City, PBS channel 13 WNET frequently has classical music concerts
telecast with sound also carried by WQXR, the New York Times' classical
music FM station.  I would suspect this is true with other major classical
outlets such as WGBH, KQED, etc.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2001 22:27:21 -0400
From: Charlie Summers <charlie@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Re:MP3/Apex 500

At 6:16 PM -0400 8/10/01, Philip Railsback is rumored to have typed:

As far as MP3s go, one disc played fine, one didn't.  I have no idea what
the problem is.  Maybe the Apex didn't like the 700mb size.  I'll try some
more discs later.

   One of the thing the great site you pointed to (
[removed] ) mentions is that, "if your
MP3 CD does not get recognised [sic] chances are it has be burnt [sic] using
ASCII and not ISO9660/Mode 1 standard." Something to look at, especially if
you didn't burn the disc yourself. (Kinda like what we Macintosh users have
to deal with when most discs are burned by Windoze machines.)

   GREAT site, by the [removed] thanks for the pointer!

By the way, where do you get VCDs?  Thanks.

   Mostly by mail from Malaysia (nope, not kidding). My "main" supplier is
CoolVCD ( [removed] ) - I've purchased mostly from this
company, and can tell you that if there is a problem (there was, once), they
deal with it quickly and politely (and once I was the envy of my neighbors,
since I received a delivery via the USPS on a Sunday). There are a bunch of
other mail-order places for VCDs; some, in no particular order (nor should
these be considered endorsements, since I haven't ordered from all of them):

[removed]

[removed]

[removed]

[removed]

[removed]

   And if you have more money than sense, and want a VCD _recorder,_ check out:

[removed]

   Oh, and to the OTR Digest readers, I'm sorry for drifting so far off
topic. But it's a pretty cool little machine.

         Charlie

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2001 22:27:19 -0400
From: "Frank Phillips" <frankphi@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  stereo tv & radio

When WSBT-AM-TV, South Bend, built their FM station back in the late '50s or
early '60s, they demonstrated the stereo sound in a special TV broadcast by
having one stereo channel broadcast through the TV and the other channel
broadcast on WSBT-AM.

I remember it, because it was so wierd at the time.

Frank Phillips
ICQ 59678389

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 08:34:19 -0400
From: Michael Biel <mbiel@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  TV Stereo Sound

I've been off-line all week, otherwise I would have answered the Stereo
TV question sooner.  Actually I had supplied some of this info here
several years ago and I thought someone might beat me to it and repeat
my own info!

In the early 50s there were several examples of using AM and FM stations
for stereocasts, most notably by WMAQ and WMAQ-FM in Chicago.  Ken
Paletic mentions that he remembers them doing it with TV programs, but
the recordings I have heard make no mention of a TV simulcast.  One of
the radio programs matches Ken's memory.  It was "New Directions" which
featured concert music conducted by Joe Gelicio.  The first recording is
dated 12/27/53.

The other program which began at that time was The New Northerners,
sponsored by the Northern Trust.  Originally titled The Northerners, it
was originally a mono program of choral music with announcing by Norman
Ross, but on December 17, 1953 they updated the program with stereo
sound, a larger orchestra conducted by Richard Shore, announcing done by
John Weigel, and a dramatic reading by a guest actor.  Charlton Heston
read from "The Cruel Sea" for the 12/17/53 program which was marked on
the disc as an audition.  The closing promoted next week's program with
the guest Edward Everett Horton, but the discs with Horton were dated
1/4/54.  The other guest I have noted was Burr Tillstrom reading "Many
Moons" on the 4/12/54 program, which he also recorded for Decca.

These recordings exist in mono only, and the discs were not notated if
they were a mix of the two channels or just the left or right channel.
Obviously NBC Chicago did have the ability to have made pairs of
recordings, but playing them in sync would have been difficult.  But
there were two notable recording engineers in Chicago who were
pioneering stereophonic tape recording at that time, Bert Whyte and
Robert Oakes Jordan.  I have a few masters from Jordan's estate, but the
person who had originally gottten the whole estate did not mention to me
any WMAQ stereo airchecks.  Whyte's widow is, I believe, still holding
onto his recordings, and I have heard rumors of some notable live
concert material that is probably there.  There's always a chance that
he did airchecks--for all I know he might have been responsible for the
broadcasts in the first place.

I've not done the research on any possibility of Chicago TV stereo
programs, but the New York Times in the 1950s confirmed  part of Dave
DiSisto's memory of the Lawrence Welk Show being broadcast in stereo,
although not by the means he describes.  The TV audio would be one
channel and the local ABC radio station would supply the other channel.
The system he describes of tuning a pair of AM radios to the upper and
lower sides of the same station is the Kahn stereo system and had not
yet been fully developed.  Additionally, it is not something that could
be casually done by the radio station, it required an ENORMOUS
investment in elaborate tuning equipment to the radio transmitters, was
something that would not have been done to all of the ABC radio network
stations to air just one series, and would have required FCC approval to
install.  (Approval for experimental use did not come until the early
80s--WSM Nashville was one of the stations testing it.)  No, it was a
very simple matter to have the TV supply one audio signal and the radio
network supply the other.  This was done for the whole 1955-56 season of
Dodge programs.

Towards the end of that season, out of the shambles of what had been
DuMont's WABD, WNEW-TV joined with WNEW radio to present weekly stereo
telecasts of Art Ford's Jazz Party.  Some kinescope film recordings
exist of this series, but I do not know of any stereo audio recordings.
I do not remember this TV series, but several years later I remember a
radio-only stereo program nightly on New York's  WRCA and WRCA-FM at 10
PM called "Jazz, Voices, and Strings" which I seem to recall was
presented by Art Ford, using recordings, of course.  By this time
several manufacturers were making AM-FM tuners that had separate tuning
knobs for AM and FM designed specifically to play these stereo
programs.  My brother-in-law still has the Heathkit tuner that he built
and loaned me in the early 60s when these broadcasts were commen in the
New York area where I was.

But that was radio--for television, the next notable stereo program was
a special episode of the George Gobel Show on 10/21/58.  This program
was sponsored by RCA Victor to promote both their Living Color TVs and
Living Stereo records and tapes.  They had a special sealed fold-out in
that week's TV Guide which at the appropriate time you were supposed to
unseal and fold out over the lower half of your lowly black and white TV
to see what you were missing.  It was a tableau of Lonesome George
sitting down among 5 or 6 girls standing on pedistals each wearing a
different colored dress. The idea was for you to see how dull the upper
half of the dresses looked.  While that scene was on I ran around the
house to our three different sized TVs to compare the differences in the
sizes of the pictures--the picture was sized for 21-inch sets only.   I
have wondered if any owners of color TVs used the fold-out to see how
inaccurate the color was displayed on their color TV!!!  I bet nobody's
color TV matched that picture!    In all probability they also did some
skits and musical numbers stressing the directional sound, but I don't
recall them doing anything special.  Although I don't have a recording
of the program, I have a mono recording somewhere of the stereo audio of
a Closed Circuit telecast the previous month, 9/23/58 where RCA Victor
dealers were invited to the local NBC-TV station to find out about the
big advertising tie-ins RCA was planning to help them sell oodles of RCA
color TVs and stereo phonographs.  Gobel was not considered important
enough to appear on that Closed-Circuit, but the RCA Victor spokesman,
former bandleader Vaughn Monroe, was.  In fact, Monroe was the center
channel.  Two RCA Vice-Presidents were placed on the left and the right
channels.

Lastly it was mentioned that there might have been a Disney stereocast
of Fantasia in the late 50s.  Although there were several programs were
Fantasia segments were included, I see no program in Leonard Maltin's
complete list of Disney TV episodes (in The Disney Films) that would
support this belief of an episode devoted to Fantasia.  However he does
list--and I distinctly remember--the 1/30/59 telecast of The Peter
Tchaikovsky Story.  Although Maltin does not mention it, it was
broadcast in three-channel stereo.  The TV would supply the center
channel, and your AM and FM radios would supply the two outer
channels.

Steve Salaba mentioned hearing about a Duke Ellington recording in
stereo from the 20s.  Close.  The two sides were recorded in February
1932 and were studio recordings, not a stage performance.  Although
Arthur C. Keller of Bell Labs had been experimenting with stereo
recordings as early as 1927 and was recording the Philadelphia Orchestra
in stereo in the early 30s, the Ellington stereo Victor recordings were
accidental.  Judging from the prefixes of the matrix numbers, Victor was
comparing the sound quality of recordings made on Western Electric and
RCA equipment, and Steve was correct in his recollection that it was the
chance discovery of some record collectors that revealed that stereo
could be retrieved.  The two collectors had great difficulty in
maintaining synchronization of the pairs of discs when they did their
tape in the 80s for an LP issue.  The originals are not 78s--they were
recorded at 33 1/3 RPM for the short-lived RCA Victor Program
Transcription LP record series.  Each side runs close to ten minutes.
When Seth Winner did the mastering for Victor's CD issue a couple of
years ago he was astonished that one of the sides maintained
synchronization throughout, and the other side required re-syncing only
once in the middle.  He had prepared himself for hours of work.
Additionally, despite the ledger notation of the use of different
equipment, he did not have to adjust the equalization to get the two
channels to match in sound quality.  Both sides were released only in
the huge 100th Anniversary box set, but one of the sides was included in
the sampler CD for the set.  Collectors have noted some classical sets
that RCA Victor and the British Gramophone company recorded in dual-disc
accidental stereo, but there is great controversy surrounding these
recordings.  All of us who have been involved in this situation were
amazed when RCA finally admitted that the Ellington's actually were
stereo--it is still be an uphill battle for the classical recordings.
It's an [removed] subject here which we've discussed in the past on the
78-L.

Michael Biel  mbiel@[removed]

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 08:34:21 -0400
From: Conrad Binyon <conradab@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Last of the Calling All Cars Players

These are the last of the players I have who are credited with
appearing on the show:

[removed]

[removed]


CAB
--
conradab@[removed] (Conrad A. Binyon)
   From the Home of the Stars who loved Ranches and Farms
     Encino, California.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 13:26:33 -0400
From: Fred Berney <berney@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Re: Stereo Radio and TV

Stereo was something I was interested in big time back in the 50's. I had
learned how to take two tape recorders and turn over one of the heads and
then run a single tape through both machines to get two tracks. Thus a poor
man's stereo.

So, when television started broadcasting in stereo, I was right there
following every show. Many I actually recorded.

On radio, back in the days before the FCC changed the rules, a person could
own both an AM station and an FM station. So, when stereo became the craze,
the station would run one channel through the AM transmitter and the other
channel through the FM transmitter.

Back then, for the most part, they were simulcasting the same program on AM
and FM. So, this didn't take up any extra air time.

With television, the network that had a radio affiliate, would team up. For
example, Perry Como broadcast what I think may have been the first stereo
broadcast. The NBC radio station carried the shows sound track. In fact,
they even when so far as I recall, as to run three separate signals.

AM, FM and Television sound. I forget which was which, but one of the
channels was a center channel. So you were told to place a radio on one
side of the TV and then another radio to the left of that radio, or
something like that.

But, definitely two channel stereo via radio and TV sound.

The Perry Como show as a 60 minute show, and at about the half way point,
they did the stereo broadcast which ran about 30 minutes.

Public broadcasting did the something with their PBS TV station and their
PBS radio station. By that time I owned a Pentron stereo recorder and was
having a hay day recording stereo.

Of course the classical music  radio stations did this on a regular basis
with their AM and FM stations.

Then finally, FM was allowed to run stereo with their sub carrier and we
have what exists today.

One other thing, so that those that were just watching the TV and not using
a radio for the second sound track. the broadcast was done with a sum/and
difference signal. The TV sound carried both tracks. The radio carried the
left track minus the right track.

I have an article on this somewhere, but I don't remember the technical way
this worked, other than the signal was delayed a microsecond on one of the
tracks. So that by having the radio and TV on, you got a stereo effect. If
you just had one turned on, you heard both channels.

Probably one of the engineer on this list can explain this in more
technical terms. All I know is that it worked.
Fred
For the best in Old Time Radio Shows [removed]
New e-commerce page [removed]

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 13:26:35 -0400
From: Fred Berney <berney@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Re: Radio Expressions

I got to thinking about this the other day. How many expressions do we now
use that were started by a radio performer.

Red Skeleton - I calls them the ways I sees them.

Maxwell Smart - Sorry about that. (that's TV - sorry about that)

Sparkie (No School Today) Hi Hey Hello there (does anyone actually use
that? - but it just came to mind)

I know there are more, can about else think of some?
Fred
For the best in Old Time Radio Shows [removed]
New e-commerce page [removed]

--------------------------------
End of [removed] Digest V2001 Issue #260
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