Subject: [removed] Digest V01 #50
From: <[removed]@[removed]>
Date: 2/12/2001 9:30 PM
To: <[removed]@[removed];

------------------------------


                      The Old-Time Radio Digest!
                         Volume 01 : Issue 50
                    A Part of the [removed]!


                           Today's Topics:

 Re: Paul Harvey                      [Michael Biel <mbiel@[removed];       ]
 Pistol Packin' Moviegoers  (was Dale [Michael Biel <mbiel@[removed];       ]
 Captain Midnight Urban Legends       ["Stephen A Kallis, Jr." <skallisjr@]
 Re: Paul Harvey                      [LBohall@[removed]                    ]
 Paul Harvey                          [danhughes@[removed]                 ]
 OTR/OSR  in the 21st Century ... We  ["Stephen A Kallis, Jr." <skallisjr@]
 I believe in serials                 ["steven kostelecky" <skostelecky@ho]
 Re: Old Time Radio on the Air        [OTRChris@[removed]                   ]
 Dale Evans                           [William L Murtough <k2mfi@[removed];]
 suspense [removed]              [Bruce Tartaglia <brucet@steamboat-s]
 THANK YOU                            ["Owens Pomeroy" <opomeroy@[removed]; ]
 Age is relative, isn't it?           [LeeMunsick@[removed]                 ]
 wedding shows                        ["Rodney w bowcock jr." <rodney-self]
 The Chesterfield [removed]             [LeeMunsick@[removed]                 ]
 A positive note on Uncle Don         [BOBFABRIS@[removed]               ]

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 08:45:12 -0500
From: Michael Biel <mbiel@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Re: Paul Harvey

I disagree with all of the names mentioned as the source of Paul
Harvey's vocal style.  Actually, I'm not surprised that nobody has
mentioned the man whose style Harvey has CLONED, not merely copied.
It's because there are not too many circulating complete broadcasts of
that man.  His name was Gabriel Heatter.  Sure, you all know of him as:
"Aahhhh, there's GOOD news TONIGHT!!!"  But once he really gets rolling,
his voice dives and rises, he pauses for effect, then resumes in almost
a whisper, then rises to a SHOUT!!  He pulls all the vocal stunts that
Harvey uses, and none of the others mentioned even come close.
Heatter's career was ending as Harvey's began, so there was very little
overlap to remind the public of the original.

Phil Chavin mentions that neither Harvey's office nor Chuck Schaden has
any recordings of him from the 40s into the early 50s.  I have a home
recorded disc of the opening of a Harvey newscast in 1947 when he
announces the birth of Prince Charles.  The excerpt is less than three
minutes long.  At the Northwestern University NBC Chicago collection,
the only Harvey recording we had was a disc of his December 1950 annual
special Christmas Eve story, but I recall that when I tried to find it
to tape it shortly before I left I couldn't find it.  It was probably on
the reverse side of another program and the file card to show where it
was shelved might have been missing.  If J. Fred MacDonald didn't find
it when he taped much of the collection after I left, then it probably
was gone before Schaden got to the collection.  Then again, it might
still be there--is Larry Lichty still subscribed?

Michael Biel  mbiel@[removed]

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 08:45:14 -0500
From: Michael Biel <mbiel@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Pistol Packin' Moviegoers  (was Dale Evans)

Richard Pratz described the scene at Roy Rogers/Dale Evans movies in the
40s:
The ruckus with our cap guns got to be so bad at the Bertha Theatre
on Chicago's Northside, that the management eventually made us check
our sixguns at the door before we went in.   Rich

Here in Kentucky they would probably have let you in with a REAL gun.
But actually I've recently had an experience similar to yours.  At the
midnight screenings of "The Rocky Horror Picture Show" in Lexington's
Kentucky Theatre they confiscate everyones' water pistols!  Rice, toast,
and toilet paper rolls they can clean up, but they don't want us getting
the place all soggy wet!

Michael Biel  mbiel@[removed]

[removed]  Did you know that Lexington is the home of Transylvania
University?  Really!

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 08:45:16 -0500
From: "Stephen A Kallis, Jr." <skallisjr@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Captain Midnight Urban Legends

Over the course of time, I've noted that the Captain Midnight Secret
Decoder Ring was a myth. I've even speculated that this resulted from an
imperfect recollection of secret compartment rings and decoders. I've
even pointed out that the cryptological premiums from the OTR show were
called Code-O-Graphs; never "decoders." (Oddly, the television premiums
were called "decoders"; but then, the TV show was not only nonCanonical,
but revisionist, with many differences from the original.)
Another canard was that the "secret messages" broadcast at the end of
some episodes were Ovaltine commercials. The derivation of this one is
obvious: Jean Shepherd had a monologue wherein he was supposed to have
sent in for a Radio Orphan Annie club pin (also a cipher device), and the
first message he deciphered was a message to be sure to drink Ovaltine. I
never listened to the show (it left the air when I was six) but those who
did and have club pins indicated that the messages for that show were as
with the later Captain Midnight show, messages involving the story line,
not commercials.
There's another one. In Jim Harmon's Nostalgia Catalogue ([removed],
1973), he notes, speaking of Captain Midnight premiums, "There were
rings: a Queen of Sheba Ring, an Aztec Ring, and others." The Aztec Ring
was actually the Mystic Sun God Ring, with Aztec decorations, but what of
the Queen of Sheba Ring? One of the relatively few recordings circulating
of the Ovaltine-sponsored Captain Midnight programs, Jewels of the Queen
of Sheba," spent a portion of the drama on a fabulous ring with a
triangular stone with a letter signet ("the Hebrew letter 'S,'") that
supposedly was once the property of the Queen of Sheba. In the course of
the program, Chuck Ramsay suggested to Captain Midnight that a ring
"something like that" might be a good souvenir for Secret Squadron
members. Captain Midnight indicated that he thought such might be a good
idea. In addition, in the dialogue, the Secret Squadron leader indicated
that the color of the stone had changed, and that it now had a "greenish
glow."
For those used to premium buildups, it seemed obvious that the show would
soon be offering a new ring. That, and the "greenish glow," led some
collectors -- not just Jim Harmon -- to believe that the ring involved
would be a Queen of Sheba Ring, probably with a luminous element.
However, such speculation was in error: the actual premium was the
Initial Printing Ring, which enabled Secret Squadron members to
"authenticate" messages to each other. The Initial Printing Ring had a
single letter soft-plastic stamp on its crown, and the stamp was covered
with a brass shell containing an inkpad. The clue in the program was
mention of the "letter 'S,'" not the "greenish glow." But to this day,
I've heard people make reference to the nonexistent Queen of Sheba Ring.
Stephen A. Kallis, Jr.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 09:33:24 -0500
From: LBohall@[removed]
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  Re: Paul Harvey

I'm a little taken aback by the notion that Dan Rather, et al, do not slant
their stories. Anyone who believes that is naive. Paul Harvey's slant is
conservative. No doubt about it. But Rather and the rest of the broadcast
readers are liberal. If you don't believe they aren't, just look at how they
report what they [removed] the fact that everyone of their broadcasts on
any given day will feature the same lead story presented the same way.

There's nothing wrong w/Paul Harvey's [removed]'s nothing wrong with
Rather'[removed]

Larry Bohall

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 10:28:30 -0500
From: danhughes@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Paul Harvey

Larry asks (of Paul Harvey newscasts)

I'm a little confused. What do you mean by ''slanted'' and untrue?

It's been several years ago, but I heard Paul Harvey read a story (on his
15-minute midday show) about hippies high on LSD who watched an eclipse
and were thereby blinded permanently  (He was almost gloating when he
read this story, by the way).

The next day he retracted the story, because it simply was not true.

I think I've heard of other instances where his personal hatred of the
counterculture clouded his judgment to the point that he aired other
stories without verifying them if they gave a boost to his social or
political leanings.

---Dan

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 10:28:32 -0500
From: "Stephen A Kallis, Jr." <skallisjr@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  OTR/OSR  in the 21st Century ... We Have the
 Technology ...

Dick Habegger, speaking about Owens Pomeroy's suggestion that OTR could
be broadcast once more in the 21st Century, notes,

Yes! We are at the edge of a new technology that affects everyone.  It
is Satellite Radio Services. <snip> digital-quality radio to motorists
and home reception in the continental United States for a monthly
subscription fee of $[removed] <snip> So, now is the time to contact each of
the providers to lobby OTR! If the interest is there, the channels will
be available, everywhere!! This is an ideal medium for OTR, 24 hours a
[removed];<

Well, I can see three possible objections.  Not wanting to be a wet
blanket, before satellite-broadcast OTR can be broadcast, it'll be
necessary to address the following:

* Reception.  If satellite-broadcast OTR is to be a factor at home and in
one's car, then both have to have receivers that can tune into such
broadcasts.  So, in addition to a monthly fee, one may have to install
special equipment, which doubtless will have costs of their own.  Which
would be what?  Also, would one have to "buy time" for each receiver?
And how would the provider know whether the user was using?

* Motivation.  With 100 channels, it's probable that one could be set up
like AMC on the cables.  But, like AMC, there has to be sufficient
perceived need for OTR for it to be broadcast.

* Availability.  A lot of OTR transcriptions are unavailable for
rebroadcast.  If I had a collection of, say, Lone Ranger recordings in my
private collection, and there was a satellite broadcaster down the
street, if I loaned the collection to the station, they couldn't air the
episodes, because neither I nor they have the rights to broadcast them.
Some collections of OTR shows have been syndicated ([removed], The Shadow and
Gang Busters), but those with syndication rights would feel justifiably
that the only way these items would be aired would be for a fee.  Even if
an OTR channel on such a satellite service would follow the AMC model --
periodic reruns of each show on a daily and weekly basis -- there might
be enough OTR material available for "24-7" coverage for any extended
period.

Don't forget that technology already exists to bring OTR -- or more
realistically, OSR -- to hone and car already.  It's called radio.
Indeed, it's the same medium that was used to begin with.  If there's
sufficient interest to convince a satellite-radio service to broadcast
such shows, there's just as good an argument for the various radio
stations broadcasting right now.

Today, many smaller AM and many FM stations are almost entirely
automated.  Under computer control, these stations schedule all
announcements, commercials, and program material (music, etc.), all of
which has been prerecorded.  Getting one of these stations to air OTR or
OSR would merely be  getting them to accept the recordings, placed in a
format compatible with their equipment.  This, of course means that the
person persuading the broadcaster has to have broadcastable material in
sufficient quantity to cover the time slot, and will have to be
persuasive enough to get the station to air the programs.

It can be done.  It could've been done since OTR went off the air.

Stephen A. Kallis, Jr.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 10:44:52 -0500
From: "steven kostelecky" <skostelecky@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  I believe in serials

I agree with Stephen Kallis's idea about using serials to promote radio
drama. All it would really take would be a programmer willing to give 15
minutes a day during drive time to an ongoing story--during that time the dj
could get together another half-hour or so of innocuous ramblings on the
latest game or sitcom from the night before or whatever they want to talk
about. I think people might be intrigued once they got used to the form.
This programming would work in rural areas (like where I live) where people
spend inordinate amounts of time in their cars driving long distances as
well as those sitting in traffic gridlock. I think an "I Love A Mystery"
revival would be a nice mix of the outrageous and realistic. When a werewolf
pokes his nose in Jack Packard's face, he still refuses to believe it can be
for real--this seems to fit in with the modern sensibility pretty well. Otr
worked for the same reasons modern audio drama works--the mind's eye is a
powerful tool.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 10:44:50 -0500
From: OTRChris@[removed]
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject:  Re: Old Time Radio on the Air

I used to listen to OTR on the air quite regularly  . It seems there used to
be more of it and more often.

But to be honest I don't listen to it much [removed] the air that is .
Once I found out about the clubs and the vendors and being able to program
for myself what I want when I want I just don't want to listen to the highly
edited stuff they play on the air.

By the way -

In regard to current programming it is possible that
short form dramatic style programming might work in drive- time . If the
shows were compelling enough.
I just don't know if the economics are there or not.
You see what people often do not realize is that Radio dramas do often have
the highest ratings in their  time slot even in modern times . However, they
are more expensive to produce so the return is often lower.
And a drama show brings in a special [removed] the sense that they are
listening to hear the show rather than the station. When the drama  is over
and the station returns to its format there is probably a large tune out from
the drama fans. A station today tries to build a schedule that follows a
particular format and build an audience on that format.



-Chris

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 13:12:30 -0500
From: William L Murtough <k2mfi@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  Dale Evans

Before I transferred to KNX (CBS-Hollywood) in 1945, my friend, CBS
announcer Roy Rowan had been dating her. She was a staff singer at KNX.

As to repeat broadcasts, they were live when I joined CBS in New York in
1944. At 485 Madison only shortwave studios 31 and 32 had transcription
machines. They were originally used for our short wave operation. There
were a couple of transcription studios (TR-2, TR-3, etc, each of which
had an announce booth). The time between the two shows would only be 2
1/2 hours for for thirty minute shows and 2 hours for one hour shows.
Enough time for supper. I recall an occasion when the engineer, who lived
in town, forgot to come back.
There would be no reason for a director not to make a script change for
the second broadcast if he felt there was a need.

I would regularly be assigned to KNX master control on Sunday afternoon.
The Jack Benny show to the full network would always run over. It was
followed by a split network feed of Red Skelton and Corliss Archer. This
meant that I had to get both directors to coordinate so that the two
networks could be put back together for the following program which was
again full network. The lady director on the Corliss Archer show would
always make up the time. One Sunday Skelton became fed up and his show
opened cold with Red exclaiming, "Mr. Benny, there are other programs on
this network besides yours". I am sure Jack heard it when he listened at
home to the West coast repeat. I was always amused when the Benny group
would pass my big window single file after the show with Jack in the
lead, then Mary, Don, Dennis, and so forth. About eight or ten people.
Jack would always give a big wave, which meant that all of the rest of
the group would also wave.  I forget how I responded to the salute. I
found Jack to be a friendly, nice guy when I had occasion towork with
him.  When Jack switched to CBS he insisted on bringing his engineer,
George Foster, with him. He also included his people, including George,
in his financial dealings. That's loyalty.

By the way, there was a time we had two delay networks operating. During
daylight time we had a one hour delay for standard time stations, and the
three hour delay for the time difference. I do not remember all the
details as many moons have passed. I do recall on Sunday evenings going
over to Radio Recorders to play back a repeat of "The Whistler" to the
Arizona Network. Apparently they had some conflict. In those days, even
though routine, network operations could be complex.

Speaking of Paul Harvey, his broadcast originated from his home, like my
friend Lowell Thomas. His originating station (WGN?) wanted to save
sending his engineer to his home ("peanuts" but not unusual for
management eager beavers). Harvey refused to come to the studio, so as to
protect his engineer. He won the case.

Bill Murtough

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 15:37:58 -0500
From: Bruce Tartaglia <brucet@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject:  suspense [removed]

I apologize if this one has already been
asked a number of times, but I am dying of curiousity.
Lately, I have been listening to a great deal of Suspense.

My question regards the advertising that I have consequently
listened to. Was Roma wine any good? What happened to it?
My friend is a wine dealer and he said that he had never
heard of it. I don't expect it to be all that much, but
listening to all these commercials has made me
curious enough to try it. Hopefully, listening to all this Suspense
has made curious enough to try crime. I think I'll be okay in
that regard, but wine I just gotta know about. ;-)

Any comments would be [removed];nbsp; Thank you.

Bruce
-- Bruce Tartaglia Steamboat Software, Inc. Tel: (323)665-0454 Fax: (323)665-5273 [removed] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 16:21:44 -0500 From: "Owens Pomeroy" <opomeroy@[removed]; To: [removed]@[removed] Subject: THANK YOU I wish to thank all of those OTR fans who asked for a copy of the OTR poem "Tribute", which ran on these pages a couple of weeks ago. And especially to those of you who took the time to mention it in the Digest. Thank you one and all. There are still plenty of copies left. If any one wants a copy, email me at the address above. **************************************************** NEW PREMIUM AVAILABLE Our Club, The Golden Radio Buffs Of MD, Inc., has just come into possesion of yet another OTR Premium to share with you. Thanks to one of our Media Members, we have a rare premium from the Vic & Sade show distributed by Jelke's Good Luck Margerine during their 1939-'40 season. A booklet containing "100 PRIZE - WINNING HOUSEHOLD HINTS". with some favorite recipes by Sade ( Dixie Gingerbread, Pioneer Pumpkin Pie, Good Luck Fruit Drops, etc.) And you thought Heloise was first? This premium is our gift to you in return for a donation of $5 to help maintain our GRB artifacts exhibit: Send check/mo payable to GRB of MD, Inc. to Premium Offer, 3613 Chestnut Avenue, Baltimore, MD 21211. - 30 - Owens Pomeroy ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 18:10:16 -0500 From: LeeMunsick@[removed] To: [removed]@[removed] Subject: Age is relative, isn't it? Speaking of our ages: I'm delighted and encouraged to read all the young folk in their teens and twenties climbing into OTR. Think of the rich memories they will have when they grow up, the same ones we have, as opposed to their contemporaries. What will THEY wax romantic and misty-eyed and enthusiastic about? Marky Mark? Ice T? Dairy Queen, Mickey D and MTV? I just entered the Social Security set, although I'm not ready for Geritol. I recall listening in the late 40s and 50s to Jack Benny, Fred Allen, and all the great holdovers from the 30s and 40s. But also there were the new shows of the time: Stop The Music, X Minus One, Candid Microphone, The Halls of Ivy. My favorite way of listening was flat on my back in front of our big floor-model multi-band RCA, on which I often did late-night DXing, and listened to Voice of America, Radio Moscow, and other short-wave emanations. This served me in good stead later as a News Director when I knew of UN Radio, VOA, Moscow and other emanations which I could pick up on my trusty Zenith Trans-Oceanic multi-band portable to provide my station's listeners with a varied number of news sources. Were I to lie down on the floor now to listen to anything, I'd probably be asleep in 5 minutes. In any case, it would certainly be a great deal more difficult to drop down there. Not to mention getting back up again! Actually, I find the greatest boon of radio cassettes is listening in the car. When traveling on any long trip, one certainly can't stay with anything worth-while on one's car radio these days. In the 1960s I traveled around the country, a different city each month. I often drove to my next work city on Sunday. I had the great pleasure of hearing the Mormon Tabernacle Choir program as many as four or five times during the day, on as many different CBS stations. What marvelous sound! I don't know when they send it "down the pipe", but I suspect it's late on Saturday. Perhaps someone can enlighten me. Some years ago I tried anew to find where to listen to the program. I wrote the Mormon Church in Salt Lake City, that city's Chamber of Commerce, KSL, and CBS. No-one seemed to be able to answer me. We recently moved to "Southside Virginia", where we listen to an NPR station out of Virginia Tech. So what pops up there, every Sunday morning at 7:30? You guessed it. The organist, choir director and possessor of "the spoken word" are all new names, but it's still the Mormon Tabernacle Choir, based at Tabernacle Square. Still originates at KSL. Now why couldn't any of them answer me so I wouldn't lose all these years of great listening? [removed] love it, what little of it is worth listening to these days. Thank Heaven for the cassette tape recorder! Without it, this hobby of ours simply would not exist. And aren't we fortunate that it does! Lee Munsick "That Godfrey Guy" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 18:45:07 -0500 From: "Rodney w bowcock jr." <rodney-selfhelpbikeco@[removed]; To: [removed]@[removed] Subject: wedding shows Once again, I don't have the date in front of me, but I've heard a good Abbott and Costello Show where Costello gets back from Uncle Hugo Costello's wedding. The boys then decide to start a matchmaking service. If my memory serves correctly the show was from late 1943, maybe early 1944. Does anyone know who the guests at the Cincinnati convention will be this year? Rodney Bowcock ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 21:25:57 -0500 From: LeeMunsick@[removed] To: [removed]@[removed] Subject: The Chesterfield [removed] I recently purchased a set of tapes of Perry Como's programs. Very pleasant. Actually, I somehow duplicated my order and bought two sets. Anybody want the extra? Included in the set was one of several programs aired from the Tobacco Distributors Convention in Chicago, c. 1950. I recall they had Perry Como, Bing Crosby and Arthur Godfrey kidding each other. Interestingly enough, I learned listening to this set that Como's regular Chesterfield shows had no studio audience. Maybe they were afraid the audience would fall asleep. Now, now, Lee, be nice. He certainly was relaaaaaaaaxxxzzzzzzzed, wasn't he? I thought I'd finally found the program I distinctly recall, in which Msrs. Crosby and Godfrey kidded each other for some time about their respective frozen orange juice companies, Hi-C and Hi-V. Butthis was not that show. I now suspect this took place on the Bing Crosby show that week. Crosby's Hi-C eventually became Minute Maid, which I think is now owned by Coca Cola. Remember his commercials for them? "Minute Maid Orange Juice is Better for Your Health--repeat--repeat--repeat ad nauseum". Mr. Godfrey's partial ownership was in Hi-V, an offshoot of the Rosenthal family's Geritol/Serutan empire, the name of which I think was Pharmaceuticals, Inc. These were townsfolk of mine; I went to school with the Rosenthal kids. Hi-V was not as fortunate as Hi-C, for I don't believe it or any successors survive. It may well have been a victim of the "Twenty-One" disaster, which was sponsored by Geritol. If you've not seen it, I heartily recommend Robert Redford's film "Quiz Show" about that whole mess. But I [removed] Chesterfield, back to the A-B-C outings (from their then sales slogan, "Always Buy Chesterfield"). The slogan was featured widely on radio, on their cigarette cartons, and in print advertising with Arthur Godfrey, Bing Crosby, and Perry Como. They and other Chesterfield-sponsored personalities were to entertain the tobacco businessmen gathered in the Windy City, and of course the nationwide listening audience, presumably puffing away. Chesterfield obviously requested the cross-guesting on each others' programs, regardless of the networks involved, which normally discouraged this sort of thing. This might be a good time to point out that another Chesterfield slogan, "Buy 'em by the carton", although widely used by Chesterfield, came not from Liggett & Myers or their advertising agency, but from Arthur Godfrey himself. He thought it up and used it widely, and Chesterfield picked up on it. Buying cigarettes by the carton before then was not widely practiced by the smoking public, and certainly not by we non-smokers. You [removed] had marketing surveys which found a family of loyal listeners who bought a carton every week where not one person in the family smoked, bless their [removed] wanted to reward the sponsor of their favorite programs! Can anyone help me find the "orange juice" show I want? I'm fairly certain it was NOT on a Godfrey airing, so what's left is Crosby. Or maybe Bob Hope? Any help will be greatly appreciated. By the way, hello and Happy New Year to all. This greeting has been delayed by a complex PC problem, a lengthy holiday trip, and a return home just in time to catch the flu. Net total over a month lost. But I'm (cough) much better (cough) now! Be well! Lee Munsick "That Godfrey Guy" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 21:25:59 -0500 From: BOBFABRIS@[removed] To: [removed]@[removed] Subject: A positive note on Uncle Don I had been thinking of posting this some time back, but was afraid it would start a [removed] now the general subject has been broached--- It was the summer of 1939, and the New York World's Fair was in full swing. My father managed one of the attractions there and we had season passes, which I utilized to the fullest, being a precocious 9-year old. One Sunday, I found myself at the New Jersey exhibit, and in the lobby was a glass-enclosed booth. Inside was "Uncle" Don Carney, reading the Sunday funnies over the air. The booth was a remote for WOR, which I had always thought of as a New York station, but was actually owned by the Bamberger stores of Newark, with transmitter in Cartaret. Well, he saw me through the glass and invited me into the booth where we chatted for a moment and he went back to the job of explaining the comics to the kiddies, while I helped turn the pages. After the program ended we had a little chat - he always knew where there was a present for me on my birthdays, telling me over the radio (courtesy of mail from my folks) but what did I know??? I sent a copy of thisto Liz - to get it 'on the record'. Bob -------------------------------- End of [removed] Digest V01 Issue #50 ****************************************** Copyright [removed] Communications, York, PA; All Rights Reserved, including republication in any form. 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