Subject: [removed] Digest V2001 #364
From: "OldRadio Mailing Lists" <[removed]@[removed];
Date: 11/12/2001 8:20 PM
To: <[removed]@[removed];

------------------------------


                            The Old-Time Radio Digest!
                              Volume 2001 : Issue 364
                         A Part of the [removed]!
                                 ISSN: 1533-9289


                                 Today's Topics:

  Re: Man of many Voices                [ hal stone <dualxtwo@[removed]; ]
  Re: Oral Roberts                      [ "James B. Wood, [removed]" <woodjim@ ]
  William Holden and Harry Bartell      [ Dennis W Crow <DCrow3@[removed] ]
  Re: More on NBC Pearl Harbor Recordi  [ Elizabeth McLeod <lizmcl@[removed] ]
  Re: Paper Discs                       [ Elizabeth McLeod <lizmcl@[removed] ]
  Re: Setting the record straight       [ OTRChris@[removed] ]
  Re: Amos 'n' Andy in Canada           [ Deane D McIntyre <dmcintyr@ucalgary ]
  otr connection to hbo                 [ lawrence albert <albertlarry@yahoo. ]
  ISLAND OF DEATH                       [ PURKASZ@[removed] ]
  Language on the air--sort of          [ "welsa" <welsa@[removed]; ]
  The awesome Aussie                    [ hal stone <dualxtwo@[removed]; ]
  TV Eclipses Radio                     [ "@" <josephpostove@[removed]; ]
  "Paper Discs"                         [ TedOTR@[removed] ]
  "Paper Discs"                         [ TedOTR@[removed] ]
  Re: Tape Baking                       [ NorthernRd@[removed] ]
  Hoarders, Lucy, and Libraries         [ "General Manager" <genmanager@radio ]
  Kate Smith                            [ "jay ranellucci" <jayran33@hotmail. ]

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 11:51:51 -0500
From: hal stone <dualxtwo@[removed];
To: OldRadio Mailing Lists <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Re: Man of many Voices

badaxley@[removed] just opined.

Don't care whether you rant, rave, or provide the
wonderful info you do, I just enjoy your input.

Thanks, Bad (May I call you by your first name?)

<SNIP>I was listening to several Archie Andrews shows
that covered a number of years.  You apparently
perfected your teenage voice as the years went by.  The
first one I heard, about 1945 or 1946, during the
opening (Relax Archie, Relax) you sounded like you were
just too pooped to pop.

You know what [removed]'s probably because Dubs of the show were recorded
from a slow playback machine. (It's possible, plausible, and a pitiful
explanation) Just as I've heard other copies where I seem to be
"screeching". Obviously a dub made from a machine playing too fast.

But then again, you know how teenages can be. Maybe I was "too pooped to
pop', caused by having too many "Pop"s the night before! :)

One other explanation, and probably the more plausible, was that my original
interpretation of the "voice" for the Comic Book character was as a sleepy,
dry, sardonic sounding kid. (Much like he looked). It's possible the
director told me to "Brighten" him up a bit in later episodes.

Anyway, I really enjoyed you on the show and look forward to your digest
inputs.

Thanks ever so much. You read that last line just like I wrote it. The check
is in the mail.

 Hal(Harlan)Stone
 The "Jughead" of at least two vocal variations.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 14:43:03 -0500
From: "James B. Wood, [removed]" <woodjim@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: Re: Oral Roberts

[Oral Roberts] ...invited listeners to touch their radio [removed]

	There was a regular parody on one of those
'morning zoo' commute-drive programs where a certain
"Rev. Harley J. Davidson" would instruct listeners thusly:
"Place your feet in the bathtub, your hands on the radio,
and feel the healing power of the Lord course through
your very being."

Jim Wood
Brea, CA

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 14:43:25 -0500
From: Dennis W Crow <DCrow3@[removed];
To: OTR Digest <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: William Holden and Harry Bartell

Jim Cox mentioned the Lucy 50th Anniversary retrospective.

Wasn't that Harry Bartell who "sat" William Holden at his table during the
famous episode where  Lucy proceeds to drive the star nuts gawking at him
eating? Mr. Bartell, as the chief waiter, eventually moved a plant between
Lucy and Ethel's booth and actor Holden. Finally Holden exacts revenge by
staring at Lucy!  This episode was featured as the fifth "favorite" of all
Lucy episodes.

Perhaps Mr. Bartell could tell us what it was like working with Lucille
Ball?

Dennis Crow

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 14:44:26 -0500
From: Elizabeth McLeod <lizmcl@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Re: More on NBC Pearl Harbor Recordings

Eric Cooper wrote:

They are (as far as I know--Liz, help me out here) the ONLY known =
recording
of NBC that day (with the exception of Jack Benny's regular =
transcriptions).

The Memovox discs are the only *continuous* record of NBC's 12/7/41
broadcasting (and, in fact, they run all the way thru December 8th as
well), but the NBC Radio Recording division did make scattered recordings
on the regular 16" lacquer discs at various points in the day. Below are
listed the 12/7/41 lacquers held in the NBC Collection at the LOC.
Programs marked with an asterisk duplicate material found in the Memovox
recordings:

Organ Recital -- Red -- 805--830am

NBC Piano Trio -- Blue -- 815--830am

Second Guessers -- Red -- 1200--1230pm

Foreign Policy Association -- Blue -- 1200--1215pm (This would be a very
interesting program to hear: it was a talk entitled "Japan's Hour of
Decision,")

"I'm An American" -- Blue -- 1215--1230pm

Emma Otero, Western Art Music -- Red -- 1230--100pm

Radio City Music Hall -- Blue -- 1230--100pm

University of Chicago Round Table -- Red -- 100--130pm

*Non-continuous news flashes -- Red and Blue -- six bulletins broadcast
between 229pm and 356pm. Multiple dubbings of the 229 bulletin are found
on another disc.

*Listen America -- Red -- 330--400pm

*Wake Up America -- Blue -- 300--400pm

*News Reports -- Blue -- 409--423pm

*News Reports -- Blue -- 419--500pm (some overlap from previous disc)

*News Roundup -- Red -- 515pm--530pm

*News -- Blue -- 615--630pm

*Eleanor Roosevelt -- Blue -- 645--700pm

*World News Roundup -- Blue -- 700--730pm

*George Putnam News -- WEAF Local -- 1100--1115pm

*World News Roundup -- Red and Blue -- 1130pm--1200am

As can be seen, these recordings are far from the continuous record
supplied by the Memovox discs, and include none of the
entertainment-related programming aired that day. Apparently, all the
network was interested in preserving in high-quality form was the news
highlights of the day, and most of that material seems to be here. But
only the poor-quality Memovox discs preserve the full context of the
original coverage. None of this high-quality Pearl Harbor material is
circulating, as far as I know, despite the fact that a great deal of NBC
news material has been bootlegged over the years.

Elizabeth

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 14:45:01 -0500
From: Elizabeth McLeod <lizmcl@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Re: Paper Discs

A Joseph Ross wrote:

Huh? What are paper discs?

Paper discs are exactly that -- recording discs with the lacquer coating
applied to a substrate made of cardboard or bond paper. These were very
common in the 1940s, as a cheap type of recording blank for the Recordio
home-hobbyist crowd, but were never acceptable for professional use. The
most common paper discs are the small six or eight inch types, although
sizes up to 16 inches were manufactured.

A paper disc in good condition can offer decent sound quality -- but they
are seldom found in good condition. Because the substrate is flexible,
the coating is usually covered with thousands of tiny surface cracks, and
because the substrate is not perfectly smooth, the coating is usually
uneven and noisy even if it isn't cracked. If the discs have at any time
been exposed to moisture, the core will swell and cause further damage to
the coating. They are often very difficult to transfer properly.

Elizabeth

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 14:45:56 -0500
From: OTRChris@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: Re: Setting the record straight

Hal Stone writes:

A "Whole Nation" ...God, I hope not. But I suppose a bit of an exaggeration
helps make your point. :)


I concede .

But, there are probably more good, than bad, aspects of TV (our current mass
medium), in my humble opinion.

Certainly true for those of us who are sighted . Especially valuable when
watching the Travel Channel  : )  .    Cable channels such as  The History
Channel , Discovery
and the like  are current  TV's redemption.  If all we had was NBC, CBS and
ABC
I wouldn't  even own a Television.  Some of these "History  / Nature "  shows
are great and reason enough for turning on the tube. I wish my brother would
give these channels a try  .  He happens to play   NBC  all day long.
Yeckkk!
Shark week is so popular on the Discovery channel  because of the visuals.
When radio first began experimenting with broadcasting stage plays  there
were many who weren't sure how the plays  could be translated to the
sightless medium. Whereas TV could just broadcast the play  radio was forced
to  create a new art form of storytelling techniques . For the duration of
OTR that is what it was all about .( How  the  story could be told  without
any visuals ).  For those who did it the best they created  some  fascinating
 dramas.  The best of radio  appeals to the imagination and encourages good
listening skills.  Children should be encouraged to listen now and again.  I
was encouraged to listen to the General Mills radio Theater in the late 70s
. I recall hearing  Jason and the Argonauts ( or was it  the Golden Fleece?)
. It was hosted by  Tom Bosley and was broadcast on  weekend afternoons (when
nothing much was on TV  )  .  I thought it was great a the time.  There was
also the Sears Radio Theater  and The CBS Radio Mystery Theater. Not a lot of
shows but in the TV age  about as many as could be expected . But then all of
the sudden there weren't  any  show being offered and that is not acceptable.
 How can you encourage children to listen to a contemporary  radio drama that
appeals to their imagination when there  aren't any ?  There should always be
 a few shows even in the 21st century --That is all I am trying to say. They
should be regularly scheduled  and teachers should encourage their students
to listen .  Perhaps a weekly  afternoon series of classical stories or
moments from history. Something that had some sort of educational tie in so
that they could be recommended by the  NEA.

Please don't feel I was being adversarial, Chris.

Hey this is Crossfire isn't it?  Seriously ,  I appreciate your posts and the
clarification.


Pleasant dreams.

-Chris

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 14:46:33 -0500
From: Deane D McIntyre <dmcintyr@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: Re: Amos 'n' Andy in Canada

It seems that there was a Canadian Station right across the border from
Buffalo, NY, whose signal interfered with the Buffalo station carrying Amos
'n' Andy. The program director of the Canadian station got the bright idea
of going off the air for 15 minutes and then selling that "dead air" to
advertisers who would get a spot anouncement right before the statuon went
silent every night and again upon its return to the air

Eric Cooper

This station was CHML in Hamilton, and the Buffalo station that carried
Amos 'n' Andy was WBEN. As CHML was on 900 and WBEN was on 930 (and both
stations still are on those frequencies) in Hamilton it was difficult
to get WBEN if one had a lower quality receiver. This the bright idea
of selling "dead air":).

Here in Calgary in the 1930's station CFCN (which along with CFRB Toronto
was the most powerful station in Canada) wanted to carry Amos 'n' Andy
among other popular American OTR but had a problem - unlike eastern
Canada, there were no wire links to the US networks. So CFCN picked
up KSL Salt Lake City (CBS) and KOA Denver (NBC) off air and rebroadcast
their signals:). Eventully they were forced to stop however by goverment
regulation.

Deane  McIntyre

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 14:47:06 -0500
From: lawrence albert <albertlarry@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: otr connection to hbo

Regarding the recent posting concerning HBO's
production of "Band of Brothers," two of the episodes
were written by the son of my friend Peggy Jordan.
Peggy is the grandaughter of Jim and Marion Jordan,
Fibber and Molly, and the daughter of film and radio
actress Peggy Knudsen.
  The proud mother told me the young man, whose name
escapes me, wrote the second episode, I think, and the
one about the Nazi death camp.
 Larry Albert

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 14:48:47 -0500
From: PURKASZ@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: ISLAND OF DEATH

    Regarding Pearl Harbor announcements, there is an ironically titled
episode of Inner Sanctum broadcast on the night of December 7th, 1941 called,
"The Island of Death."
    A short blurb by an announcer before the beginning of the show that
evening describes what must have been a most terrible day.
    When I lived in Honolulu in 1965, I used to fly over the site of the USS
Arizona in a 1938 Harvard Trainer, a plane not unlike the Japanese Zero.
    It was always a Sunday morning when the rising sun from the east rendered
the sea a copper sheen that gave a somber beauty to the whole scene.
    I go there every year. It never fails to instill a mood. Now that the
"Mighty Mo" is nearby, it makes for a most uplifting and memorable day if you
are ever in Honolulu.
    Contact me if you plan to go as I still have very close contacts with a
gentleman who will fly you over the site.
    Odd, how the events of 9/11 have united us once again.
                 <A HREF="[removed],+Michael+C.">Michael
C. Gwynne</A>

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 14:49:04 -0500
From: "welsa" <welsa@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Language on the air--sort of

There has been s ome talk about inappropriate language on the air.  While it
may nothave been approved for broadcast, that's not to say it wasn't in the
scripts.

I have a copy of an original script here (although I can't put my finger on
it right now).  I think it was a Great Gildersleeve episode.  In it there is
a cue for a sound effects which was supposed to be loud.  In parenthesis
following the cue was the added direction:  Make this a hell of a sound!

If that happened often, it's amazing the words didn't wind up on the air
just by accident!

Ted

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 14:54:41 -0500
From: hal stone <dualxtwo@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: The awesome Aussie

One thing of concern is the reference to the book notes piled on the desk.
I guess that means the book will not be hitting the stands in time for
Christmas 2001.

Hi Ian, My friend from Waaay "Down Under". The way things have been going
around here, I'll be lucky to finish it by Christmas 2002. Maybe ground Hog
day?...if I'm lucky. (Do you have Ground Hogs down your way, or have the
Croc's eaten them all).

Here I was, thinking that Hals absence was due to the time
he was spending on the book, but no, he is spending time chatting up young
otr lovers.

Don't I wish [removed] [removed] defending my Honor, reputation and
integrity. (But I do "Chat Up" my wife whenever possible). :)

Jennifer, make sure you listen (watch) carefully to what Hal is saying.

I hope that advice gets through to her, Ian.  But I'm afraid it will fall on
deaf ears. As Sir Rodney Dangerfield always [removed]"I get no Respect".

I followed most of the Diamond back, dodgers etc, <SNIP>

Atta Boy, Ian my [removed] We'll make an honorary Yank out of you [removed] but
definitely not a "Yank-ee" fan.

Perhaps if posters have to nominate
what systems a particular software works on, then sports posters should have
to nominate the sport they are discussing.

Well lookie here! I do believe Charlie, (our revered leader), just got an
Aussie "ZINGER"

Welcome back Hal, now go and finish that book.

Right, Mite. and a didgeradoo to you too.

Good to hear from you Ian.

Regards, Hal Stone


[ADMINISTRIVIA: Not a zinger, but a sensible suggestion, particularly since
we shouldn't be discussing sports scores past September of 1962 and so team
names may not make as much sense as you think. Heck, I didn't even know there
was a baseball game the other [removed]'ll have to listen to it in thirty or
forty years.  --cfs3]

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 15:30:29 -0500
From: "@" <josephpostove@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: TV Eclipses Radio

TV Eclipses Radio
Just another perspective on the thread on how television almost immediately
surpassed OTR in this country.

I was watching an episode of  "I Love Lucy" this morning. The Ricardo's and
the Mertz's are sitting in the living room one evening, when Ricky asks for
suggestions for what is obviously their nightly ritual; what to watch on TV.

They decide, and then after a number of tries at adjusting the set
(contrast, brightness, clarity, [removed]) they manage to break it. What do they
do now?!!?
This is about 1951 or 52 and they are at a loss at what to do when the tv
set is broken. Lucy suggests that fine old art of conversation ("remember
what we used to do before tv, sit around and talk?) and the four of them
give it a try. But they have forgotten how.

Lucy then has a great idea. She goes into the back room and brings
[removed] radio! All of them look at the thing as if it was from another
century, rather than the mass medium of only a few years ago. They look on
the ancient artifact fondly and decide to listen to the radio. The episode
goes on from there to have Lucy and Ricky appear on the radio quiz show
(hosted by the great Frank Nelson BTW).

As much as I love radio (and some of the best ot radio is from the 50's) and
believe that properly nutured, radio could have continued to be a secondary
entertainment medium, I think the above points out just how early (and at
the first opportunity) the average American tossed radio in favor of
television.

Joe Postove

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 15:56:58 -0500
From: TedOTR@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: "Paper Discs"

Elizabeth writes:

Unfortunately not -- these discs were the only continuous recordings that
NBC saved for its Pearl Harbor coverage. They weren't paper discs - they
were "Memovox" recordings, made on a dictation-type machine that NBC used
to make crude-and-dirty reference recordings for logging purposes.

I am the dealer that nobody wants to name that has these for sale. By the
way, I would like to thank everyone for the extremely nice things thay had to
say about me and RADIO MEMORIES.  It is always nice to hear when your work is
appreciated. They were in horrible condition, but I offered them for the
historical significance.  I was told, from my source of the recordings, that
they came from paper discs.  Elizabeth contacted me quite some time ago and
told me of the actual source of the discs, "Memovax".  I must admit that I
have no earthly idea what these are, but I am sure that Elizabeth is right.
I never changed my wording from "paper discs".  One of the reasons it was
never changed is that I didn't think that too many people would know what
"Memovax" was (I know that I sure didn't).  The other reason is that, quite
frankly, I have never got around to it.

Ted Davenport
Radio Memories

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 18:04:05 -0500
From: TedOTR@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: "Paper Discs"

One thing that I forgot to mention.  The reference to "paper discs" will be
removed from my website and the correct information substituted.  My aplogies
to all.

Ted Davenport
Radio Memories

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 18:05:13 -0500
From: NorthernRd@[removed]
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: Re: Tape Baking

John Edwards wrote;

Tape squeal has been the most often problem when one occurs.
Have a question though what does it mean to "bake" the tape to
eliminate tape squeal. I have used water to eliminate the squeal
enough to get a good copy transferred, but had never heard of "baking".

Baking is a process for rescuing otherwise unplayable tapes that have been
affected by a specific problem commonly called "sticky shed syndrome." You'll
find a number of articles on the web by doing searches for "sticky shed" and
"baking tapes".

You'll also find links to training videos from various Baking Associations,
but that's another story.

Three good articles about the subject:

[removed]
[removed]~[removed]
[removed]

The solution that has worked well for me over the past few years is the food
hydrator made by American Harvest, as described here:

[removed]

and here:

[removed]

Email me off-list if I can be of any further help.

Alan Bartenhagen

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 18:06:06 -0500
From: "General Manager" <genmanager@[removed];
To: <[removed]@[removed];
Subject: Hoarders, Lucy, and Libraries

In reply to a few recent postings:

Ian Grieve writes:

It saddens me to hear stories about the gaps in series or in some cases
whole series, that are not available because a
collector or collectors have decided they are the only ones who should have
those shows and refuse to make them available >for others to enjoy.  <snip>
I am refering to well known collectors who are well known only through their
reputation as >hoarders and once they get their hands on a series, thats the
last that will ever be seen of it.  Sad, very sad.

It is true that, although the majority of OTR collectors are quite generous
with their collections, there are others who are far less so. In fairness,
some aren't able to share some of what they have due to agreements made with
the persons from whom they obtained the disks. Others may indeed *want* to
share what they have, but simply haven't had the time or financial resources
to transfer the disks and/or tapes.

Libraries and institutions that possess large quantities of original radio
material are often blamed for not making their collections more readily
available, but they are usually not to blame for the restrictions. Donations
usually come with built-in legal restrictions regarding use and, unless they
come with a sizeable fund for preservation of the materials, the recipients
simply don't have the resources to do much with the collections aside from
basic storage. (That so few of them - especially places like UCLA - devote
much energy to *seeking out* the necessary funding for preservation is a
whole other story, of [removed])

I have been fortunate to only come across a few people in the OTR world who
could be considered "hoarders," and have found that most of them were not
only unwilling to share their rarities, but upon additional investigation,
were often found to have acquired them under less than ethical
circumstances. Realizing that my own reputation - and that of the Archives
as well - could easily be compromised by a relationship with them, I thought
it best to steer clear.

Don't worry too much, though. Quite a few of the "hoarded" items eventually
see the light of day - as is the case with the four Fred Astaire "Packard
Hour" shows currently in circulation. I understand that the disks for these
spent many years under the bed of a collector in Southern California. When
he died, the disks were found, sold, and placed in circulation shortly
thereafter.

* * *

"A. Joseph Ross" <lawyer@[removed]; writes:

Huh? What are paper discs?

I've seen three examples of wartime paper-based transcription blanks
produced for professional use: two were severly worn 16" RCA Phonograms,
green cardboard-based disks with a celluloid coating, and the other was a
16" cardboard Presto. All contained radio recordings and were found and
saved by Ty Settlemier, a long-time record collector and Archive volunteer.
All were transferred for us by Elizabeth McLeod and, though noisy and
fragmented in nature, produced sound that really wasn't all that bad
considering the storage medium. Nothing as good as glass or aluminum based
blanks, but certainly acceptable for one-time use.

I've also seen a number of cardboard-based disks produced in the early
1930's containing parts of Rudy Vallee's "Fleischmann Hour" shows - but I'll
leave the description of them to Elizabeth, who not only transferred them
but also knows considerably more about them than I do. However, you can view
a sample of the label portion of one of these disks by visitng the Archives'
website:

[removed]

* * *
Jim Cox  <otrbuff@[removed]; wrote about the two-hour CBS-TV special on the
fiftieth anniversary of I Love Lucy.

I found this to be a very entertaining program, but was sorry to note that
there was never any mention made of "My Favorite Husband" preceeding "I Love
Lucy," especially considering that Jess Oppenheimer and Madelyn Pugh had
worked with Lucy on this series before proceeding to television. A small,
nit-picky criticism of an otherwise well-produced special -- but then what
did you expect from a radio enthusiast? ;-)

One bright spot was the interview segments with our own Gregg Oppenheimer,
son of Jess - an occasional contributor to this forum. Nice job, Gregg!

* * *
hal stone <dualxtwo@[removed]; observes:

And I know lots of people that prefer reading books. (I'm going broke with
the amount of books my wife buys to read. She's a reading machine.) :)

I have just two words for you, Hal: public library. When I'm not laboring
away with the First Generation Radio Archives, my profession is supervising
a busy public library in Washington State. (For those of you who enjoy books
on tape, your library probably has those to lend as well -- and I bet they
have some OTR and OSR, too.) Had to get in plug in for your public library,
as well as the Archives! After all, libraries pay my salary!

Harlan

Harlan Zinck
First Generation Radio Archives
[removed]

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 18:06:19 -0500
From: "jay ranellucci" <jayran33@[removed];
To: [removed]@[removed]
Subject: Kate Smith

Hi All,
Just noticed on my wall calander that last Sunday November ll, 2001
marked the first public performance in 1939 of "GOD BLESS AMERICA".
It was sung by Kate Smith.  62 years ago!
I hope my calender is right, if not I guess someone (Elizabeth?) will
correct this post.          Jay

"The only good radio is OTR"

--------------------------------
End of [removed] Digest V2001 Issue #364
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